John Gruden Firing

[vcdgrips]

JTQ says:
"For clarity, everybody on the planet called Jon Gruden "Chucky", and many, no doubt said this to his face, a reference to a murdering, psychopathic doll from the movie "Child's Play" ( https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0094862/?ref_=ttfc_fc_tt ). Surely, Jon Gruden would find no offense in any of those comments and I'm sure everybody who called him "Chucky" has been asked to resign from their job."

False Equivalency Argument.

Not remotely the same as making a racially disparaging comment. Particularly when you are public figure/commentator/coach in an industry that is majority Black in composition.

[TheNewbie]

I’m more concerned that we know so much about people’s private communications, than with what they contain. Gruden has probably done more for black players than most of the clowns who are bitching and getting wound up over this.


If someone goes about complaining about whites in private but hires them, trains them, and works with them to build a successful enterprise, who cares? How truly pathetic do you have to be to want to make a significant character judgement based off of private conversations?


I agree with him about women in football, but I wouldn’t go about handling it the way he did, and much of the language was unnecessary. However, even if I totally disagreed, it’s private communications that I don’t want to know about. I’m sure there are plenty of people I like that have disparaged people like me, or things I believe in. If they did it in private, WHO CARES?


This nation is becoming a clown show of too much useless knowledge of people’s private lives, without enough forgiveness, and we have a focus of the wrong kind of piety.


America is so well off that Americans are choosing to lose their meaning and in turn, boredom is taking over.

[Borderland]

The fact that anyone still gives a shit about anything related to football continues to amaze me. It's a childs game that should stop mattering when you leave high school...sorry but not really.

I think sports builds character. I played baseball in HS. End it there. It shouldn't be a ticket to a million dollar contract. Because you happen to have some athletic ability you shouldn't be on a free ride the rest of your life. It serves no purpose other than entertainment. Does everyone have to be entertained on Sunday because they're lives are so desperate? Evidently.

Around here a lot of checkers in retail wear the Seahawks jerseys on Friday and Sat. It's almost a cult following. How about those Seahawks, eh? Lots of merchandising also. Russel Wilson has his own frozen dinners that taste like cardboard. I know because my wife bought some. A friend of hers said they were awesome. She was all excited and dropped the $50. I could have had a decent diner at a good Mex joint with a few beers for less.

I'm not saying I don't watch the NFL. I do a day after the game and I can get the highlights in 10 minutes on YT with no commercials. Some people still watch the 3 hr games and complain about the 2 hrs of commercials.

[TheNewbie]

Sports provides several important things for a society.


Entertainment is actually important, plus sports can unify people of all kinds of diverse backgrounds. There is an attack on sports by the Left, because American sports, especially male sports, in their more pure forms are a threat to the American Left.


Why shouldn’t someone make tons of money playing sports? 99% of TV and movies are crap, but the actors make a lot of money because people freely choose to pay to watch it. Free market.

[Lon]

This applies to anything NFL related. He played stupid games. He won the stupid prize.

[Joe in PNG]

This applies to anything NFL related. He played stupid games. He won the stupid prize.

I think I gave my final one back in 2014.

[Borderland]

Why shouldn’t someone make tons of money playing sports? 99% of TV and movies are crap, but the actors make a lot of money because people freely choose to pay to watch it. Free market.

Why shouldn't someone make tons of money selling illegal drugs then? People freely pay to use those drugs. In some parts of the country it's a free market because there's no enforcement against people buying or using illegal drugs. The city of Seattle supplies the needles for heroine users and nobody gets arrested for illegal drug use.

Is that not a free market?

[Navin Johnson]

Why shouldn't someone make tons of money selling illegal drugs then? People freely pay to use those drugs. In some parts of the country it's a free market because there's no enforcement against people buying or using illegal drugs. The city of Seattle supplies the needles for heroine users and nobody gets arrested for illegal drug use.

Is that not a free market?

So.....child pornography is a free market?

[vcdgrips]

The Newbie says in quotes. My responses in bold


"I’m more concerned that we know so much about people’s private communications, than with what they contain. Gruden has probably done more for black players than most of the clowns who are bitching and getting wound up over this."

Pure assumption. You have no idea how much Gruden has done for "black players" at all. Ergo you have no basis in fact to compare what Gruden has or has not than any of the "clowns" who are bitching..."




"If someone goes about complaining about whites in private but hires them, trains them, and works with them to build a successful enterprise, who cares? How truly pathetic do you have to be to want to make a significant character judgement based off of private conversations?"

Frankly, I do not follow our first sentence at all. The fact that somebody makes private remarks does not mean their such remarks are not an accurate reflection of their character or lack thereof. Indeed, a definitional aspect of possessing character is conducting oneself well at all times, particularly in private when no one is watching... or listening.



"I agree with him about women in football, but I wouldn’t go about handling it the way he did, and much of the language was unnecessary. However, even if I totally disagreed, it’s private communications that I don’t want to know about. I’m sure there are plenty of people I like that have disparaged people like me, or things I believe in. If they did it in private, WHO CARES?"

Where so you draw the line about women besides football- engineering, medicine, law, aviation, mathematics, other "manly things?" What you are essentially saying is that it is perfectly acceptable to be sexist or racially disparaging in private, so long as you have a civil tongue when you do it.

May your brown children have men who think exactly like you and be in the position to discipline them at school/at work or not, award them scholarships or not, hire them for jobs or not, offer them admissions to a school or not and may such men be the parents of those to whom your brown children date and/or court and/or marry.

[TheNewbie]

VCD, I wish you the best (mean that!). You and I operate in such different realities that we might as well speak two different languages. You may well be right, and I may be wrong.


You are more concerned with people’s private thoughts and their race than I am. This is likely a big source of our differences.


It is not ok to be racist or sexist in any setting, but there is a big difference between private comments and how one actually behaves in society. Though the terms racism and sexism have been so cheapened it is hard to know what people mean when they use them.


I can actually say I’ve helped change someone’s mind about race, in a positive way. From that person focusing mostly on race, to them focusing mostly on behavior. I’ve also stood up to true racism in a public setting when most stayed silent. I’ve been there, I’ve done that.

My boss is a female. She’s a good boss.

¡Quiero que las mujeres sean doctoras!

You can hold the above views, while at the same time recognizing true racists vs stupid racist comments, and appreciating females while wishing for male only sports to still exist.


The crazy thing, I bet a lot of females would agree with me.