GP100 In Local IDPA Match

[JonInWA]

I hear you, Jon... but unless I read/comprehended wrong you mentioned only 2 rounds of the Silvertip that gave you trouble.

Overall I concur with your latest post. Your thoughts make sense to me, so I will agree to AGREE...

Ron, I re-read the thread, and I see that I documented 3 specific Silvertip cartridge issues; 2 with a Wolff 12# mainspring, and 1 with the 14# Ruger mainspring (but I'm pretty sure that there were several others in pre-match practices).

Again, keep in mind that I really wanted the 145 gr Silvertips to be vetted, as it was obtained at the express recommendation of some LEO's and former LEO's here in p-f that I respect, based on the 145 gr's duty performance when issued and used as a duty load in major metro departments back in the day. After the issues I experienced, and in conjunction with feedback from others, I will neither use or recommend the 145 gr .357 magnum cartridges at this point. Given a combination of others' successful use, and re-testing with a suitable quantity of current production cartridges, I might reconsider, but for the time being I'll stick with the 158 gr Federal HydraShoks.

One other thing; when I double-checked the work that Ruger had done on the GP100 during it's check-up, in addition to replacing the hammer dog, transfer bar, springs, adjusting the endplay/timing, and re-blueing, they also replaced the entire mainspring assembly, not just the mainspring itself.

Best, Jon

[Chuck Whitlock]

Again, keep in mind that I really wanted the 145 gr Silvertips to be vetted, as it was obtained at the express recommendation of some LEO's and former LEO's here in p-f that I respect, based on the 145 gr's duty performance when issued and used as a duty load in major metro departments back in the day. After the issues I experienced, and in conjunction with feedback from others, I will neither use or recommend the 145 gr .357 magnum cartridges at this point. Given a combination of others' successful use, and re-testing with a suitable quantity of current production cartridges, I might reconsider, but for the time being I'll stick with the 158 gr Federal HydraShoks.

The bolded part may be key here. I seem to recall it discussed here on P-F that Winchester had significant QC problems a few years ago, around the time that they moved from a union state to a non-union state....I seem to recall that there was even speculation about deliberate sabotage.

[JonInWA]

Yesterday I shot the GP100 in a local IDPA match, going through about 100 rounds, followed by a 25 round 5x5 classifier. Cartridges were a mix of full-house factory (1,200 fps 158 gr) and .357 light (1,000-1,100 fps) handloaded .357 magnum; my squad immediately realized I was shooting .357 magnum after the first cylinder. The factory loads were extremely consistent, but the handloads were a bit more variable; from now on I'm just going to stick with full-house factory 158 gr.

The Hogue Tamer grips again totally validated their worth and utility. While aesthetically they're nothing to write home about, they just simply work in terms of effectively absorbing and dissipating the recoil, especially that from the full -house .357 magnums. I like their profile; the backstrap is a bit less protrusive that that on the mainstream Hogue non-Tamer rubber grip. I'm personally fine with the fingergrooves.

At one point in a stage, I had to use some .38 Special 158 gr, which shot a tad lower than the .358 magnums-aim off was easily accomplished. Several times during the match, I traipsed over to the Safety Area and brushed out the extractor star, breachface, and chambers. For loading, my initial administrative load at the "Load and make ready" command was performed with a Safariland Comp 2; all reloads during the stages were with Safariland Comp 3s. I experimented with 2 OWB holsters; a Galco Switchback (with the hammer retaining strap removed) and Bianchi UM84R (with the flap removed); both holsters allowed for smooth and effective draws and uneventful one-handed re-holstering. Both holsters are more oriented towards field OWB carry, but with their retaining strap/flap removed performed very credibly for concealed carry and match use. The Switchback is an exceptional value, priced at about $50.

I had a great time. The gun performed magnificently.

Best, Jon

[Tarrrnation!]

Thanks for the update Jon! Please keep posting.

[JonInWA]

One of the holsters that I have had for my GP100 is Bianchi’s ubiquitous UM84R holster. This is their adaptation of their M12/UM84 holster to revolvers. As provided, it’s an exceptionally well constructed holster, combining multiple materials; the exterior is ballistic weave, the interior core component is closed cell foam, and the lining is nylon/pack cloth. It has a metal Quick-Lock hinged bracket, which both allows for quick attachment and removal from a pistol belt, and concurrently provides the flap attachment. The flap, as well as the Quick-Lock assembly itself is removable, and the holster
This holster was originally designed in conjunction with the XM9 DoD pistol trials, to replace the venerable leather holster that the US military had used in various forms for various sidearms since the late 19th century-most recently with the 1911 pistol.

https://op2.0ps.us/978-550-ffffff-no...4756-vids.webp

https://www.opticsplanet.com/bianchi...ack-14869.html

Bianchi establishes that the basic holster can be carried in 14 ways; my adaptation adds a possible 15th.
The holster has a polymer exoskeleton which provides vertical slots for the Quick-Lock bracket, and horizontal belt loop slots; the exoskeleton has the slots on both sides, making the holster exceptionally accepting of ancillary hardware, attachment/carry options and ambidexterity.



For IDPA competition, I recently used it as an OWB holster, with the flap removed. Since my dedicated IWB Kramer holster recently gave up the ghost (after some 25 years of use); the integral sweatshield had become too supple, necessitating a two-handed reholstering; when I cut off the sweatshield, the holster mouth lost essential support, necessitating an even more convoluted two-handed reholstering process. After bidding it farewell after many years of use, I began thinking of a suitable IWB replacement.
Ultimately, I’ll get one of Privateer Leather’s excellent offerings; owner Wes Dahl suggest that I get their Brigand, with the optional polymer mouth reinforcement. I’ve been exceptionally pleased with Privateer Holsters, so this will eventually get in the works.
However, for a field/carry expedient IWB, I took a hard look and the UM84R, and wondered if I could utilize it as an IWB. Actually, there was a very easy and expedient fix to facilitate this; I simply threaded a Tactical Tailor long Malice Clip through the right side vertical slots of the exoskeleton, which normally would house the Quick-Lock bracket if used by a left-handed shooter, and then inserted the holster inside my pants, with the Malice Clip protruding outside my pant, and placing my belt through it. Basically, what I have is a high-ride IWB holster; a tad bulky, but exceptionally do-able. I even left the Quick-Lock bracket on the left (inner) side of the holster, it doesn’t seem to be an irritant, although if desired it’s certainly removable. Essentially, the Malice Clip protrudes long enough through the exoskeletion vertical bottom slot to both allow sufficient depth of seating of the holster body inside the pants, and leaving enough loop length to allow the belt to be threaded through it. The interface between holster body, pants and belt through the Malice Clip loop is sufficient to provide a stable and secure platform for the holster and revolver, both in carry, draw and re-holstering.





So, while it’s eminently do-able as a IWB as modified with the Malice Clip, does it make sense? First, the UM84R holsters are still available new, at least from Optic Planet for $80, and I’m sure others are available out there, but it’s not on the Safariland site anymore (although several versions of the versions for semi-autos are still). At $80-100 new, there are less expensive IWB options (particularly in kydex) available, but if you have a blued revolver, the thought of repetitively banging the gun into unyielding kydex may be an anathema. In that case, leather, horsehide, or pack cloth may be a more finish preserving desirable alternative.
I think where the UM84R shines as a holster is that if have a need for a multi-use/multi venue holster, such as an OWB field flap holster, a OWB or IWB holster for IDPA (or similar) matches, and need a revolver holster for EDC. The UM84R, without the flap and with the Malice Clip as an IWB is still somewhat bulky, but it’s concealable with a medium-weight vest or jacket. However, if using the O3RN inspired Safariland CD-2 speedloader holder in the between the belt and pant mode, it’s probably preferable to use a HKS or Safariland Comp 3 speedloader for ease of speedloader extraction from the holder, as the forward bulk of the spine of the UM84R makes it a bit more difficult to grasp and extract a Safariland Comp 1 or Comp 2 speedloader.
The revolver fits fairly deeply in the holster, with the trigger and triggerguard completely enclosed, but there’s no issue in accessing and drawing my GP100 from it, particularly with the full-size Hogue Tamer rubber grips. While the holster mouth is only moderately reinforced, re-holstering one-handed is easily accomplished, at the most needing partial barrel insertion with a twisting motion to open the mouth sufficiently to accommodate the protrusion of the cylinder. The depth of the holster significantly precludes the need for a retention strap; the revolver is decently secured.

So while I’m certainly not asserting that the modified via addition of Malice Clip UM84R is the best IWB choice, I do think it’s a decent and viable alternative. It's easily accomplished with the Malice Clip, and easy to carry. For concealed carry, you will need to pay particular attention to your choice of concealment garment, though, as it is a bit more bulky and protrusive than most "purpose designed" IWB holsters.

Best, Jon

[JonInWA]

For our September local Tier 1 club IDPA match I decided to campaign my Ruger GP100.





I received a new shipment of .357 magnum cartridges from High Desert Cartridge Company to replace the problematic batch with CCI primers. With the CCI primered cartridges, I consistently experienced approximately a 10% failure to fire due to problematic primers. While it’s somewhat given that CCI primers can be like bullets bouncing off Superman’s chest, my GP100 was using a factory 14# mainspring (which was the original OEM weight; Ruger may have subsequently shifted to slightly lighter 12# mainsprings, but I have not been able to verify that).

This fresh batch of .357 magnum 158 gr jacketed ball was manufactured with Winchester brass and Winchester primers. I used it exclusively in a Tier 1 IDPA club match, which encompassed 6 stages, with a minimum roundcount of 96 rounds-I actually shot pretty close to that, because as most IDPA participants know, when you use a revolver in IDPA, pretty much every stage is gonna be a Limited stage…you simply don’t have the time (particularly re-loading wise) or on-board ammunition capacity to be sending many rounds outside of the minimum stage requirements downrange in a give stage.
I had experimentally switched out my Ruger 14# mainspring with a Wolff 12# mainspring for the match. Additionally, I installed a set of Black VZ Twister G10 grips on the GP100, which are somewhat compact (being only nominally larger than the Ruger/Altamont GP100 Compact rubber-with-insert panels grips) and have superb ergonomics and concealability, without diminishing grippability. As a sidebar, they’re also an excellent aesthetic match with the black-trimmed Privateer holster.

So-how did I, the gun and the cartridges do?

Well, unfortunately it was a train wreck. Out of my rounds fired, I had approximately 18 throughout the day that simply did not fire-even after going around for a second strike. That’s 18 out of 96….I wasn’t happy, my situational awareness suffered several times throughout the day due to my frustrations and ignition uncertainty-or reacting to the ignition failures.
After the match, I took the 18 cartridges that had failed to fire, and tried them out of my Ruger Security Six, which uses a Ruger factory OEM mainspring. Out of the 18 that had not fired in the HP100 initially, around 6 of them did fire successfully out of the Security Six on their second time at bat. However, the remaining 12 or so did not….And the firing pin strikes were solid, centered and with more than sufficient depth for primer ignition.



I also as a cross check after the match ran a cylinderful or so of factory Federal American Eagle full-house .357 magnum 158 gr JSP cartridges, and 6 rounds of the High Desert Cartridge Company’s defensively oriented 158 gr .357 magnum medium velocity using Hornady XTP bullets; my understanding is the Darryl Boelke worked this load up with Steve Shields as an effective, but medium velocity .357 defensive load. Both the American Eagle and the High Desert defensive .357 magnum loads worked impeccably.
Back to the problematic cartridges. Prior to the match, I had run each cartridge through a case check block and visually examined each primer for proper seating. The GP100 was clean and lightly lubricated. The firing pin on the GP100 was carefully examined for proper protrusion with a feeler gauge and operation, and it was well within acceptable Ruger tolerance measurements, and the firing pin spring tested to be fully functional, with no apparent integrity issues (with both the firing pin and the firing pin’s spring).

In a separate range session, I switched the Wolff 12# mainspring back to the Ruger 14# mainspring; I didn’t think that the 12# Wolff mainspring weight was a causal factor, but I wanted to remove all doubt, back I went to the Ruger factory 14# mainspring.
Unfortunately, I had similar results; out of 68 rounds, 6 failed to fire.
A bright side to the day was that I was able to run the GP100 with my new Privateer Leather IWB Brigand leather holster/ In detailed discussions with owner Wes Dahl, I took his suggestions that I have him incorporate a polymer holster mouth reinforcement, and his variable cant feature. Since my GP100 has a beautiful custom blue finish, I decided to go with a Royal Blue dyed holster body, with Black leather reinforcing and Black belt loops (incorporating Pull-the-Dot grippers). The Black trim is what’s visible above the belt when the holster is used, to aid in concealability. The holster is magnificent, both aesthetically and operationally. The GP100 slide into it like a bank vault door closing, and draws are unimpeded, but the gun is very securely held in the holster.









So, at the end of the day my conclusions are that at this point I simply cannot in good conscience recommend High Desert’s .357 magnum 158 gr jacketed cartridges until the ignition issues are fully sorted out and I can believe (and experience) complete reliability with them. They are well manufactured and clean shooting-when they go off….
I’ve had stellar results with High Desert’s other cartridges-their .45 ACP 230 gr TMJ ball, and their 124 gr 9mm jacketed ball; I’ve experienced zero issues with both cartridges, and used them for training and match use, so I recommend them highly. I wish I could do the same for their .357, but empirically I simply cannot, at least at this time.

Best, Jon

[dannyd93140]

I own 6 GP's and been shooting them for 35 years over 100,000 rounds and never had any problems like that. Holy Cow.

[JonInWA]

Quick follow-up note: The 6 cartridges that did not fire that I have an image of were out of the 68 that I fired AFTER replacing the Wolff 12# mainspring with the OEM 14# Ruger one in my GP100.



In the match proper (when I was using the 12# Wolff mainspring) there were 18 failures to ignite; immediately subsequent to the match, out of those 18, 6 did fire out of my Ruger Security Six which has a factory OEM Ruger main spring (but 12 did not).

Sorry for any unintentional muddying of the waters regarding the sequence of events.

Best, Jon

[dannyd93140]

Do you have the new style firing pin or old style.

Old style use's a pin to secure it.

New style use's a cap screwed in the back of firing pin.


Check the transfer bar to make its seated all the way to.

[JonInWA]

Do you have the new style firing pin or old style.

Old style use's a pin to secure it.

New style use's a cap screwed in the back of firing pin.


Check the transfer bar to make its seated all the way to.

Thanks, Danny. Mine is a 173 prefix serial, an April 1998 production piece, as verified by letter from Ruger. The firing pin is retained on it with a recoil plate cross pin, part # E49. The transfer bar was one of the components replaced by Ruger at its last service with them, and fits well. Firing pin travel is smooth and unimpeded to its stop, and firing pin protrusion is .055+.

Best, Jon