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Thread: COVID 19: Violence; Threats; Criminal Activity

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe in PNG View Post
    I've heard this sort of thing referred to as "Gee Whiz Facts"- factoids that sound impressive until you get the rest... of the story.

    Kind of like when my sister came in second when she ran the 2 mile at a track meet. Second of two, that is.
    Yup. 6 doesn't sound like a lot but if it's all the beds in the ICU it's still 100%.

  2. #32
    Site Supporter Sensei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRoland View Post
    This is semi-true, actually: https://www.wbko.com/2021/08/28/powe...r-leitchfield/

    But the missing context is that this hospital had 6 ICU beds, with all 6 filled with COVID patients: http://www.k105.com/2021/08/26/owens...are-beds-full/

    So 22 is not the operative number here, 6 is. It doesn't seem like a false claim.
    For further perspective, that hospital has 75 licensed beds which means that it is rather small. 75 is a maximum as most hospitals have enough staffing to operate most but rarely all of the beds at any given time.

    Moreover, it would not surprise me if 6 beds is the extent of their ICU. I would be very surprised if those beds are covered by an intensivist 24/7; mostly a combination of internal and family medicine trained hospitalists +/- a tele-ICU capability. That typically means they can hand a little sepsis or non-invasive ventilation. 6 patients with severe ARDS and multi-system organ failure from COVID would overwhelm that system.
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  3. #33
    Site Supporter Kanye Wyoming's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blues View Post
    As can I. But I still think the glue is developing cracks.
    Sorry in advance for the diversion and drift.

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  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by HCM View Post
    I agree something is really wrong - hence this thread,

    The forged Van cards were brought up in one of the other COVID threads - I think the politics one.
    I've called it "The Crazy Years," a la Heinlein, but I think it is a widespread lack of belief that the Republic means anything anymore.

    Crisis divides us further, so what exactly is the point of the USA if it can't help much with serious problems?

    The small government advocates won. They made their vision of a government that is always ineffectual a reality. They got a big boost from big government advocates who made sure every policy was studied, formulated, and promoted by folks with no buy-in to the results of said policy and/or direct connections to busness entities who have a strong position to make enormous profits with privatized solutions financed by public dollars.


    Our military doesn't exist to win wars. It exists to buy expensive weapons systems, and advertise the superiority of them to the options served up by competing nations.

    Our solution to providing higher education for the nation? Provide a student loan set-up where the only way to default is death. By law. Works great for the DeVos family.

    "Failing" (total bullshit, BTW. When we compare our system to say, Japan, we include everyone, Japan is only showing the students who didn't get pushed into vocational education. That tends to skew things a bit.) education? Let's put public money into thousands of privately owned magic bullets, never mind the fact they all have a 10 year half-life, under ideal circumstances, we will have new very expensive magic bullets to replace them by then. Or go all the way with charter schools where 20% of public funds, typically, just turns into private profits with track records of success overall no better or worse than purely public schools. (I have no problem with individual charters, often they do a great job in a niche, it's the idea of charter-run systems that is complete grift.)

    Mostly our system serves a rent-seeking class that thinks an ever increasing share of the pie is their right as the owners of the country.

    Why should anyone outside that class have much belief in where the USA is going?

    And the global economic system is largely an American system. Which is why so much of the planet is facing the same issues.

    Given all that, why place much importance on public duty, or honor, when graft is obviously the marker of "the winners" in our culture?

    TL;DR: Most folks realized they aren't part of the class that owns the world, and no amount of hard work is likely to increase their ownership much. And folks screaming "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" are likely rich, retired, or nearly retired and have no clue things are different than when they got out of school in the early 70s.

    We are in a singularity. (Not The Singularity of tech bro fantasy) No one has much clue what lies next. That's usually when violence as a signifier of group identity becomes very important. "We may not know all the solutions, but we know who creates the problems!"

    Given chaos, graft is a highly logical response. $$$ is always good, rewards for decent behavior seem increasingly uncertain.

    On a completely unrelated ( 😈 ) note, I decided to get the fuck out of public service myself this week. It's a path to certain misery. Good lessons, but it looks like I'm going back to foodservice. Hopefully sooner than later. The current job market is pretty amazing.
    Last edited by Baldanders; 09-08-2021 at 10:21 PM.
    REPETITION CREATES BELIEF
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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hambo View Post
    Everybody else wins when assholes show up and shoot each other. We shouldn't discourage them too much.
    Maybe a "trade in your crappy gun/baseball bat/shiv for a nice semiauto Beretta 12g" program for such events? With plenty of heavy birdshot shells in big baskets free for the taking in baskets along the road every 6 feet or so.

    Minimal collateral damage and plenty of free (if scratched) guns for decent people afterwards.
    REPETITION CREATES BELIEF
    REPETITION BUILDS THE SEPARATE WORLDS WE LIVE AND DIE IN
    NO EXCEPTIONS

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK11 View Post
    In Trumpland, six critical beds is not nothing.

    I'd also like to see the documentation on the hospital spinning the numbers just to get funding.
    Much of rural NC saw their access to even standard ER rooms evaporate as Vidant Health closed hospitals to increase profitability in the past decade..They "couldn't afford it."

    Bonuses equal to the amount needed to keep the hospitals open for the guy who decided to close them? Surprisingly affordable!

    Hey, I'm sure an extra 30 miles on an ambulance/lifeflight trip won't lower anyone's chances of survival from a heart attack or anything, right?
    REPETITION CREATES BELIEF
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  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baldanders View Post
    Much of rural NC saw their access to even standard ER rooms evaporate as Vidant Health closed hospitals to increase profitability in the past decade..They "couldn't afford it."

    Bonuses equal to the amount needed to keep the hospitals open for the guy who decided to close them? Surprisingly affordable!

    Hey, I'm sure an extra 30 miles on an ambulance/lifeflight trip won't lower anyone's chances of survival from a heart attack or anything, right?
    Speaking as someone who worked as lower level management in a hospital system and saw this first hand:

    If your chances of survival are lowered, too bad.

    A hospital costs money to run. Many small hospitals are under water financially. Even in NYC, something like 18 hospitals have closed in the last two decades.

    You can't magically snap your fingers and make hospitals run without funding, regardless of being a counter-culture (needless contrarian?) edgelord.
    "Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baldanders View Post
    Much of rural NC saw their access to even standard ER rooms evaporate as Vidant Health closed hospitals to increase profitability in the past decade..They "couldn't afford it."

    Bonuses equal to the amount needed to keep the hospitals open for the guy who decided to close them? Surprisingly affordable!

    Hey, I'm sure an extra 30 miles on an ambulance/lifeflight trip won't lower anyone's chances of survival from a heart attack or anything, right?
    Missouri (Republican) lawmakers voted against medicaid expansion in the state some years ago, despite the fact that it would be a huge benefit to rural hospitals that serviced largely Republican areas (the Democratic urban centers have hospitals). The question got put to voter referendum and the passed with a fair amount of Republican voter (not politician) support. Republican lawmakers in the state basically said the citizens could vote for it, but they didn't have to do it (going against the Republican governor who wanted to implement it). So rural residents get screwed by their own elected officials for a few years while the governor deals with the court ruling against the legislature.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by TGS View Post
    Speaking as someone who worked as lower level management in a hospital system and saw this first hand:

    If your chances of survival are lowered, too bad.

    A hospital costs money to run. Many small hospitals are under water financially. Even in NYC, something like 18 hospitals have closed in the last two decades.

    You can't magically snap your fingers and make hospitals run without funding, regardless of being a counter-culture (needless contrarian?) edgelord.
    As @Bio stated, their would have been little issue with funding with medicaid expansion.

    But our Republican legislature saved us from that.

    Just like they saved us from counties developing high speed internet on their own to "prevent government competition with the free market!" So instead of universal high speed internet installed 10 years ago, we have a patchwork of very expensive, very poorly performing services with small areas of service.

    Certainly you see the difference between closing small hospitals in a densely populated urban region closing, with plenty of other hospitals, as opposed to closing the SOLE provider of emergency services in a county?

    But the mentality in your post is pretty typical of many Americans who have been so heavily propagandized by our ownership class: "see you stupid hippie shit, IT'S BASIC ECONOMICS! WE CAN'T AFFORD IT! YOU'D BANKRUPT US!"

    Which makes sense if you think that the only way to fund healthcare is too have an atomized and privatized system where every hospital must "pull its weight."

    Or you could approach the question from an actual public health policy orientation and figure out how to deliver OK emergency care to our rural areas, perhaps by spreading out the cost over a large public health care system, instead of going for the profit-maximizing social Darwinist approach?

    But the way we do it is neither orientated towards a goal of universal decent healthcare nor maximizing individual treatment outcomes. It's based on profits. And our efficiency in terms of spending to results/coverage among wealthy nations is shitty:

    https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jam...stract/2674671

    Conclusions and Relevance The United States spent approximately twice as much as other high-income countries on medical care, yet utilization rates in the United States were largely similar to those in other nations. Prices of labor and goods, including pharmaceuticals, and administrative costs appeared to be the major drivers of the difference in overall cost between the United States and other high-income countries. As patients, physicians, policy makers, and legislators actively debate the future of the US health system, data such as these are needed to inform policy decisions.


    As if we based policy on data. In the US, healthcare policy grows out of corporate needs.

    But good job expounding the views of our parasitic rentier class.
    Last edited by Baldanders; 09-08-2021 at 11:43 PM.
    REPETITION CREATES BELIEF
    REPETITION BUILDS THE SEPARATE WORLDS WE LIVE AND DIE IN
    NO EXCEPTIONS

  10. #40
    Member TGS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baldanders View Post
    Certainly you see the difference between small hospitals in a densely populated urban region closing, with plenty of other hospitals, as opposed to closing the only provider of emergency services in a county?
    I see the difference between viable and unviable based on patient census, yes.

    Whether republicans, democrats or the lizard people coulda/woulda/shoulda is pretty irrelevant to decisions based on the situation in reality. If there's no money to run the hospital, there's no money to run the hospital.
    "Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer

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