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Thread: NYPD going to lighter trigger?

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by HCM View Post
    There is an argument to be made that what ever UD risk associated with the standard 5.5lb triggers will be balanced by increased hit potential. Given the crowded environment of NYC an the fact that every bullet fired hits something increased hit potential is, itself a form of safety.
    I would argue that a change in trigger pull this significant really calls for a "Transition Course" to teach people the new trigger. Not sure what level of training they'll even be able to offer, considering their logistical issues.

    FWIW, the course we're preparing for a Striker Fired Transition is heavily focused on trigger discipline. Heavy use of 1, 2 and 3 shot drills to really maximize first shot discipline, and control of the trigger. And drills that will emphasize "backing off" after the reset during a string of fire. I think this is the only useful purpose of DA/SA to Striker Transition training.....and why it must be serious and mandatory. It should be about teaching them to shoot, and NOT shoot, the new trigger.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by AMC View Post
    I would argue that a change in trigger pull this significant really calls for a "Transition Course" to teach people the new trigger. Not sure what level of training they'll even be able to offer, considering their logistical issues.

    FWIW, the course we're preparing for a Striker Fired Transition is heavily focused on trigger discipline. Heavy use of 1, 2 and 3 shot drills to really maximize first shot discipline, and control of the trigger. And drills that will emphasize "backing off" after the reset during a string of fire. I think this is the only useful purpose of DA/SA to Striker Transition training.....and why it must be serious and mandatory. It should be about teaching them to shoot, and NOT shoot, the new trigger.
    Your concern is likely the reason why the standard trigger guns are limited to new recruits going through the Academy, at least for the present.

  3. #63
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    https://oig.lacounty.gov/Portals/OIG...e%20Report.pdf

    I wasn't expecting to get much out of an LA County OIG report on police firearms training, but this was generally on point.

    As always, training is king. I suspect NYPD will need a serious transition program to convert officers to the 5.5 pound trigger is they have been rolling with twelve pounders, My former agency went from SigSauer or revolvers only to a fairly liberal policy of carrying whatever you qualified on and the firearms staff approved (single action and DA pistols that could not be decocked excepted). It was somewhat unrealistic to expect a rookie cop to purchase a 239 (see the other thread on that pistol to see other issues) when his or her county buddies could strap on a Glock 26 or 27 several hundred dollars cheaper.

    The agency eventually went to the FNS-9 and later the Glock 17 and 19 (and, of course, a 26 for the chief because he's so important). I think we figuratively and literally dodged a bullet by not mandating more transition training, first for the troops carrying striker-fired pistol as off-duty or back-up guns, an secondly, during the transition to the FNS-9.

  4. #64
    Too many points to quote, but…

    1. I disagree with the idea mentioned earlier on a safety on a general issue firearm… from someone who frequently carries a safety equipped firearm.

    2. I had a similar experience as another poster after firing an NYC G19, I thought it was broken.

    3. If mandating a 12 trigger pull, it’s better to have a gun that comes by that naturally (or closer to) like the P226. Too bad the 92D was never an option.

    4. In summary of this move, it’s about time.

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by AMC View Post
    I would argue that a change in trigger pull this significant really calls for a "Transition Course" to teach people the new trigger. Not sure what level of training they'll even be able to offer, considering their logistical issues.

    FWIW, the course we're preparing for a Striker Fired Transition is heavily focused on trigger discipline. Heavy use of 1, 2 and 3 shot drills to really maximize first shot discipline, and control of the trigger. And drills that will emphasize "backing off" after the reset during a string of fire. I think this is the only useful purpose of DA/SA to Striker Transition training.....and why it must be serious and mandatory. It should be about teaching them to shoot, and NOT shoot, the new trigger.
    When my agency transitioned to striker fired guns from our TDA semi autos our transition course was 20 hours per officer. 4 hours of classroom and 16 hours of range time. I had one boss that was using the argument " That since the new gun is easier to shoot, we should need less training time" I used his argument against him and basically said " Yes the new gun is easier to shoot especially by accident" My chief at the time agreed with me and authorized the 20 hours

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by jnc36rcpd View Post
    https://oig.lacounty.gov/Portals/OIG...e%20Report.pdf

    I wasn't expecting to get much out of an LA County OIG report on police firearms training, but this was generally on point.
    That report is an agenda. It is misleading and while much of it is “true”, it’s crafted to make things look a particular way to support an agenda. I can’t say much in public.

    That report elicits a bit of anger from me.

    In the end I was able to present the right information to the right people and a positive outcome came of it.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalDep View Post
    That report is an agenda. It is misleading and while much of it is “true”, it’s crafted to make things look a particular way to support an agenda. I can’t say much in public.

    That report elicits a bit of anger from me.

    In the end I was able to present the right information to the right people and a positive outcome came of it.
    I'm glad that worked out for you, SoCalDep I would agree the OIG report has an agenda though I'm hard-pressed to determine what it is beyond "LASD (and Surefire) bad and stupid/OIG good and smart.

    It doesn't surprise me that people who grew up on the Beretta 92 (and revolver) without weapon lights would have more unintentional discharges than people trained on a striker-fired weapon. That is less likely to apply to switched on troops, but as always...

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by HCM View Post
    With Gen3 and older Glocks it was popular to combine the normally 8lb NY trigger spring with the minus connector to give a 6lb trigger pull with resistance through the entire LOP. I would argue that 6lb trigger would provide the difference in results vs the standard 5.5lb as the 12lb abomination NYPD has forced on their officers for years.
    I tried this setup in my Gen3 G34 with a little additional smoothing of slidy points and liked it, as someone who generally likes a good DA trigger. Would be more likely to try a Gen5 if there was some equivalent configuration available.
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  9. #69
    Site Supporter OlongJohnson's Avatar
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    Had to do a search. According to this guy, there is a combination of NY trigger spring and minus connector specific for Gen5 Glocks using OE parts.

    https://www.glocktalk.com/threads/st...#post-28908328
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  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by OlongJohnson View Post
    Had to do a search. According to this guy, there is a combination of NY trigger spring and minus connector specific for Gen5 Glocks using OE parts.

    https://www.glocktalk.com/threads/st...#post-28908328
    The minus connector and NY trigger spring for the Gen 5 exist, you can install them and they will function.

    Same with putting those parts in a Gen 4. That’s not the issue.

    The issue is those combos don’t yield the “sweet rolling break” they produce in the older guns.

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