Has anyone here run 200gr hard cast through an HK P30?

[Phaedrus]

My shooting plan is, asssuming the time is available, to shoot a warning shot, followed by a shot center of mass, and if that doesn’t dissuade the bear, all shots then go for the brain.

If that 9mm hard cast runs in your HK pistols, why not just carry that, as opposed to try to get ammo and test the .40? Do you feel that a shot that penetrates the brain with 147 grain will stop a bear less than a 180 grain of similar velocity that penetrates the brain?

That's probably a better plan, at least for the short term. On general principle most folks advocate the largest & heaviest bullet they can get for Grizzlies, and 180/200 is about the biggest I am able to use right now. Realistically I won't be needing it for a while; summer is almost finished and I'm only starting to get to the point where I might plausibly be able to use my reconstructed shoulder enough to draw and fire right-handed. I have a pretty good pile of 147gr Underwood hard cast in 9mm. Most folks around MT wouldn't consider that ideal (myself included) but it's better than harsh language. FWIW, I always have bear spray as well.

[03RN]

Hard cast seemed to run through my 10mm 1911 as well, although I elected to not carry a 1911 in AK due to field pistol considerations that became apparent after my first winter in AK.

Yeah, really depends on how much time you have to do weapons maintenance. I've fluxuated all over the place. Scrubbing my SAW every day under my poncho in jungles to kinda ignoring my g19 for weeks on end at sea which lead to some rusted out springs and a lot in between. I was carrying a stainless Springfield loaded champion on a 3 month canoe trip in Maine once. I was shocked at how fast it rusted. It wasn't a big deal though. I was just putzing in the woods. Some oil and a brush every day was a pretty simple fix.

[Phaedrus]

My shooting plan is, asssuming the time is available, to shoot a warning shot, followed by a shot center of mass, and if that doesn’t dissuade the bear, all shots then go for the brain.

If that 9mm hard cast runs in your HK pistols, why not just carry that, as opposed to try to get ammo and test the .40? Do you feel that a shot that penetrates the brain with 147 grain will stop a bear less than a 180 grain of similar velocity that penetrates the brain?

A Grizzly runs 25% faster than Usain Bolt. Obviously the brain is the best spot but it's the size of an orange and moving 34 mph, bobbing up and down. Bears are stout but not big boned like a water buffalo, so if a round does hit the body I'd like as much mass as possible. For bears my only warning shot would be OC spray- if I have to go to guns I'll be trying to make every shot count. They're simply too fast and cover too much ground in a few seconds to waste any shots. Bear threads always seem to go off the rails for whatever reason. The drought has made wildlife a bit more desperate than usual and we've had a fair amount of encounters this year in my neck of the woods. Statistically the odds of dying driving to the trailhead are much higher than the odds of being killed by a bear. Still, just as I wear seatbelts while I'm driving I consider a sidearm as a crucial piece of safety equipment in the woods.

10mm Glocks are starting to turn up again now. For a couple years I couldn't find one at all, now they're out there and the prices aren't obscene. But 10mm ammo is pretty scarce! If I found a good deal on S&W 629 I could bum a bit of 305gr hard cast from a buddy. Just haven't found a deal I could live with on a 629 or 69.

[GJM]

Yeah, really depends on how much time you have to do weapons maintenance. I've fluxuated all over the place. Scrubbing my SAW every day under my poncho in jungles to kinda ignoring my g19 for weeks on end at sea which lead to some rusted out springs and a lot in between. I was carrying a stainless Springfield loaded champion on a 3 month canoe trip in Maine once. I was shocked at how fast it rusted. It wasn't a big deal though. I was just putzing in the woods. Some oil and a brush every day was a pretty simple fix.

When I moved to Alaska in 2002, I had been competing for years with 1911 pattern pistols, and carried one daily. For my use, despite my bias in favor of a 1911, my first year in AK, I determined the 1911 was not a great choice for my field pistol use for a number of reasons.

There are the obvious maintenance considerations you reference, and wading in and out of streams and thru boggs gave plenty of opportunities for the pistol to get wet and dirty. The 1911 didn’t work to my satisfaction with a number of the holster options that I used like chest and shoulder holster, the Hill People kit bag, and drop rigs. The 1911 design with a cocked hammer allows ingress of stuff. It is relatively heavy with relatively limited capacity. The deal breaker for me, though, was the small trigger guard, thumb safety and short trigger which were a problem for me with most gloves. With cold hands possible much of the year, I switched to a LEM HK.

A Grizzly runs 25% faster than Usain Bolt. Obviously the brain is the best spot but it's the size of an orange and moving 34 mph, bobbing up and down. Bears are stout but not big boned like a water buffalo, so if a round does hit the body I'd like as much mass as possible. For bears my only warning shot would be OC spray- if I have to go to guns I'll be trying to make every shot count. They're simply too fast and cover too much ground in a few seconds to waste any shots. Bear threads always seem to go off the rails for whatever reason. The drought has made wildlife a bit more desperate than usual and we've had a fair amount of encounters this year in my neck of the woods. Statistically the odds of dying driving to the trailhead are much higher than the odds of being killed by a bear. Still, just as I wear seatbelts while I'm driving I consider a sidearm as a crucial piece of safety equipment in the woods.

10mm Glocks are starting to turn up again now. For a couple years I couldn't find one at all, now they're out there and the prices aren't obscene. But 10mm ammo is pretty scarce! If I found a good deal on S&W 629 I could bum a bit of 305gr hard cast from a buddy. Just haven't found a deal I could live with on a 629 or 69.

As you point out, bear encounters are pretty unlikely, but there are a number of unlikely things that we prepare for.

Bear spray may be a great alternative for you, especially with an injury. We don’t tend to carry bear spray in Alaska much, because we are frequently flying in small aircraft, and I don’t want it in my airspace. I also have not reconciled how I can effectively deploy bear spray and do a credible job with a firearm. An unarmed person with bear spray doesn’t have that concern.

I wouldn’t discount a warning shot, I have successfully deterred a number of grizzly bears with a warning shot, and that makes that bullet pretty effective!

My priority is reliability, the ability to place the bullet, then bullet size and construction. The point of the quick body shot is not to kill the bear but to sting the bear, on the theory bears like people, don’t like being shot.

There is no perfect solution and each of us have to work out the plan that makes the most sense for their circumstances and ability.

[GJM]

I had three or four in 10, but still have this one that I carried in AK.

[03RN]

Totally understand. I stopped carrying 1911s in an ALS while backpacking because of crud as well