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Thread: Federal Flight Control

  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by TCinVA View Post
    Hornady's versa-tite loads use the flight control wadding as well, but I've found that most guns pattern the Federal load a bit better than the Hornady load. For typical home defense the difference in patterns is unlikely to matter.
    Oddly, when trying Hornady TAP low recoil through a half dozen of my shotguns, I found it patterned pretty close to Fed FC...but when I ran it through my 1301 with both Cyl. and IC choke, at 25 yds. FC gave about a hand-sized or less pattern at 25 yds., while the TAP barely kept all the pellets in an IDPA target. Even at 10 yds., it was printing @ 10 - 12 inch pattern. It just reiterated for me that you never assume POA/POI/patterning with shotguns.

  2. #92
    Murder Machine, Harmless Fuzzball TCinVA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwb377 View Post
    Oddly, when trying Hornady TAP low recoil through a half dozen of my shotguns, I found it patterned pretty close to Fed FC...but when I ran it through my 1301 with both Cyl. and IC choke, at 25 yds. FC gave about a hand-sized or less pattern at 25 yds., while the TAP barely kept all the pellets in an IDPA target. Even at 10 yds., it was printing @ 10 - 12 inch pattern. It just reiterated for me that you never assume POA/POI/patterning with shotguns.
    Indeed.

    If I was smart I would have kept detailed statistics on this stuff, but there's no time in class to actually measure every single group and tabulate that sort of information...at least not in my life.

    When it comes to 1301's and FFC vs. Hornady I've generally observed that 9 out of 10 1301's will shoot better with FFC. That 10th will shoot Hornady better than FFC.

    Every now and then I run into a specimen that absolutely fucking hates Hornady and shoots patterns that are just straight bad even compared to conventional buckshot loads. It sounds like you found one of those. I suspect that on those guns the wad is actually being dragged off the shot column well before it's left the barrel and that is causing that kind of spread but we would need high speed video to prove that. I've run into four or five in class like that.
    3/15/2016

  3. #93
    Site Supporter rob_s's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob_s View Post
    Well I panic bought on a “case” of 250 9-pellet flitecontrol yesterday. Under the assumption that I’ll be buying a new beretta shotgun in the coming month(s).

    ETA:
    Curious how folks would rank the following in terms of desireability. U derstandong the whole “fog ore out what works best in your gun” etc. but ignoring it and going sight unseen or based on likelihood in a variety of guns.
    • Flitecontrol 8-pellet
    • Flitecontrol 9-pellet
    • Hornady critical defense
    • Other?
    Results of my panic buy are in, much to receptionist’s annoyance

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    Last edited by rob_s; 01-24-2023 at 12:41 PM.
    Does the above offend? If you have paid to be here, you can click here to put it in context.

  4. #94
    Member LHS's Avatar
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    Well, looks like the pre-SHOT rumors were just that, and the glories of #1B FFC will not be returning forthwith.

    https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/sh...ming-back-yet/


    Matt Haught
    SYMTAC Consulting LLC
    https://sym-tac.com

  5. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by LHS View Post
    Well, looks like the pre-SHOT rumors were just that, and the glories of #1B FFC will not be returning forthwith.

    https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/sh...ming-back-yet/
    Well, that is unfortunate. At least a plated 1-buck is a step in the right direction. Pretty sure there is not another plated load available.

  6. #96
    The R in F.A.R.T RevolverRob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LHS View Post
    Well, looks like the pre-SHOT rumors were just that, and the glories of #1B FFC will not be returning forthwith.

    https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/sh...ming-back-yet/
    Interesting that Federal claims it wasn't up to their standards given that it seemed to perform well in pretty much every shotgun.

    I don't buy the, "If it isn't perfect in every gun" statement. Doesn't pass the sniff test given that there are a minority of guns that don't shoot 8 and 9-pellet FC well. Nor do I buy it since 9-pellet has a consistent flyer relative to 8-pellet. If that's the case they would sell 8-pellet FC 00 buck only.

    I can't help but wonder if it's not just an economy of scale/marketing sale. People want buckshot in 00 or #4 for ill-informed reasons. Furthermore for the same ill informed reasons moar is better. So 9-pellets must be better than 8.

    I have zero proof, but I bet LE132-00 and PD132-00 outsell their 8-pellet cousins by a decent margin and that both outsold FC #1 by probably 5 or 10 to 1.

    Quote Originally Posted by 167 View Post
    Well, that is unfortunate. At least a plated 1-buck is a step in the right direction. Pretty sure there is not another plated load available.
    Yes. I hope that about 8-pellets of that plated #1 can find its way into a 20-gauge shell. Preferably with plenty of buffer and in a FC wad. But I'd just take 8-pellets of buffered, plated #1, and work out the choke to get it good enough.

  7. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by RevolverRob View Post
    Yes. I hope that about 8-pellets of that plated #1 can find its way into a 20-gauge shell. Preferably with plenty of buffer and in a FC wad. But I'd just take 8-pellets of buffered, plated #1, and work out the choke to get it good enough.
    A low recoil FC 1-buck load in 20ga would be paradigm shifting.

  8. #98
    Member GearFondler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RevolverRob View Post
    I can't help but wonder if it's not just an economy of scale/marketing sale. People want buckshot in 00 or #4 for ill-informed reasons. Furthermore for the same ill informed reasons moar is better. So 9-pellets must be better than 8.

    I have zero proof, but I bet LE132-00 and PD132-00 outsell their 8-pellet cousins by a decent margin and that both outsold FC #1 by probably 5 or 10 to 1.
    How much of the buying public even understands that #1 has substantially larger pellets than #4? Or that #1 pellets are damn near OO but with almost twice the payload? I bet it's a scary low percentage.
    And now that LE has almost entirely moved away from shotguns there's little hope that any agencies will push for Federal to bring it back.
    The best we can hope for is that the recent resurgence in the tactical shotgun amongst self defense enthusiasts will continue to swell and generate enough interest. However, if those who are new to the shotgun have never even heard of #1 FC then even this slim chance is doubtful.

  9. #99
    Member LHS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 167 View Post
    A low recoil FC 1-buck load in 20ga would be paradigm shifting.
    I've been dreaming/lusting for such a load for a decade or more. Unfortunately, nobody uses 20ga shotguns for serious work because there's no serious ammo available for it, and nobody makes serious ammo for it because nobody uses it for serious work. It's a self-licking ice cream cone of suck.


    Matt Haught
    SYMTAC Consulting LLC
    https://sym-tac.com

  10. #100
    Murder Machine, Harmless Fuzzball TCinVA's Avatar
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    Federal does have a turkey load for 20 gauge with the Flite Control wadding.

    If one was the inventive sort, they could potentially roll their own...

    A #1 FFC load seems like a great idea. In fact, it's what I have sitting in my home defense gun at home specifically because of the terminal ballistics benefit and limited engagement range. But 15 or 16 pellets is going to produce double the amount of pellet-to-pellet contact and it doubles the amount of projectiles you are accountable for to get more terminal effectiveness.

    But 8 and 9 pellet FFC is already gaining instantaneous compliance from bad guys when it's applied. It's unlikely that police departments will ever pick the shell with double the potential liability for what can certainly be argued to be surplus terminal effectiveness.

    If there's somebody in my house trying to kill me I'm certainly down with bringing as much "knock it the fuck off" as I can cram into a shell, but realistically when my #1 runs out I'll just load 8 pellet and think no more of it.

    Given that I've seen somewhat less stupendous performance from FFC in recent years, I'm not sure about their capacity to make a #1 load that is going to show up to our classes and perform well. And while I'm just one lowly hillbilly, the lessons from formal training in the shotgun are starting to drive at least the portion of the market that's serious about the defensive gauge. If Tom, Rob, Ashton and me see #1 show up and perform in an exceptionally mediocre fashion and we're honest about it (which we all would be) then the already tiny market of sophisticated civilian defensive shotgun connoisseurs becomes minimal.

    From the manufacturer side I can see it being a lot more risk than reward.
    Last edited by TCinVA; 01-25-2023 at 07:15 AM.
    3/15/2016

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