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Thread: Old Bakersfield PD qual

  1. #111
    Member That Guy's Avatar
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    In the name of honesty, I did the same drill a second time and the results were less flattering. I fumbled with not only the reload but every single draw. During string 3, because I messed up my reload and was in a hurry I even managed to yank a shot right into the lawyer zone. Very much not my best performance, but regrettably this might be a more accurate representation of my on-demand skills.

    Same gun, same kit, more or less even the same weather. So what caused the difference? Being tired, hurried, a bit under the weather... Little things like that.

    String 1: 2.12 (Holy fucking fumble, Batman!)
    String 2: 2.02 (Damnit, so close...)
    String 3: 5.38 (So why was I in such a hurry with that one shot..?)
    String 4: 3.72 (At this point I don't even.)

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    By my count I'm down 11 points, giving me a score of 89. Sucks, but it is what it is.
    IDPA SSP classification: Sharpshooter
    F.A.S.T. classification: Intermediate

  2. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Dobbs View Post
    Which brings me to an easy and convenient comfort zone of using a B-8 repair center's 8 ring (also 8" in diameter) for 10 point scoring and the rest of the target paper for 9 points. The repair center is 10.5" x 10.5", which is 110.25 square inches and is smaller than the previously stated 9 x 13 zone, which gives us 117 square inches of total area. I think that gives us a usable target that matches up well and is likely a bit more difficult overall.

    Also, for you guys out there working this course from concealment, the goal of the BPD qualification was to test street officers in uniform wearing high ride thumb break holsters with mostly 1911 pistols. So, if you duplicate that with an open carry ALS type holster or war belt holster the times and accuracy standards should gel nicely. I've shot it several times with the above conditions and have a couple of 100s and several 99s. I think it's a great course for today with appropriate memories of some great old time cops killin' LA bad guys.
    I hadn't shot this drill for quite a while and thought it would fit the bill for today's session with a friend. I haven't had any live fire for a month, and very little dry.

    As with all previous runs, I used a B-8, stapled to a TQ-21 and scored as above. I shot a PX4CC in a JM Custom AIWB under an untucked button-down.

    My raw points were 94 -- couple low right out of the black, and one up in the collarbone area from not letting the sights settle at 60 feet. I had 15 seconds worth of penalties: -3 at 10, -2 at 20, -8 at 30 (not fouled, just rusty), and -2 at 60 (a pleasant surprise). That's a final score of 79. Give me +4 to adjust for electronic timing and I passed at 83.

    Due to unavoidable events, we knew we had to keep the session short, so because we were both pretty happy with our scores, we moved on. Shot the Vickers 300 as a pure accuracy benchmark, and a quick Vickers carbine drill.

    The more I think about this one, the more I think I may just add 0.5 to all the par times to allow for the combination of electronic timing and concealment. Wayne, does that make sense to you given your comment about high ride holsters above?

  3. #113
    I’ve become a huge fan of this test and have been using it as my cold drill when I first get to the range. I’m normally shooting at B8 repair centers printed on 8.5x11” copy paper that are glued to an IDPA or USPSA target. I score it the way Tom Givens wrote when it was a drill of the month in the Rangemaster Newsletter: 10 points for anything within the 8 ring, 8 points for anything outside of the 8 ring but still within the paper, and 6 points for anything off the paper but within the silhouette. I’m leaning towards counting anything within the D/-3 zone as 0 points, though. I’ll give that a try next time and see how it impacts my scoring. I’m normally good for something in the low to mid 90s from concealment or from my warrant gear. From concealment I can generally pass the 10 foot stage without losing points to overtime penalties. I can’t guarantee it from my warrant gear, a Safariland 7365 RDS. I’m definitely slower out of the ALS/SLS holster than I used to be back when I worked uniformed patrol. Back then I was always practicing defeating the retention and acquiring a master grip though. Nowadays I rarely wear that rig. I’ll generally lose some points to overtime penalties when using it. I actually find the 60 foot stage the hardest. I can score okay on a B8 at 20-25 yards if I’m doing slow fire but the accuracy declines heavily when I’m adding speed.

    I like a lot of things about this course of fire. I’m a fan of the low round count it requires as well, especially in these times of high ammo prices. I like how the time standards are generally not gimmes. I like that it’s testing every string from the draw, which makes it more applicable to CCW folks. I like that it throws a reload into one string, but not in such a way that it heavily weighs scoring towards people who spend a crap-ton of time practicing reloads like tests like the FAST do. 2 reload 2 from the draw in 6 seconds isn’t a blazing fast standard but you also can’t make it if your reloads are so poorly practiced that you’re dropping spare mags on the floor as you try to index them.
    My posts only represent my personal opinion and do not necessarily reflect the opinions or official policies of any employer, past or present. Obvious spelling errors are likely the result of an iPhone keyboard.

  4. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by Gun Nerd View Post

    The more I think about this one, the more I think I may just add 0.5 to all the par times to allow for the combination of electronic timing and concealment. Wayne, does that make sense to you given your comment about high ride holsters above?
    I took Wayne's thumbs-up as an endorsement, so implemented this change starting with my session last week. As usual, I used a B-8C on a TQ-21. I was on fire as to accuracy (only two rounds out of the bull, both on the paper) and only missed the adjusted par times at 10' (-1) and 30' (-3). So I had a raw score of 98 and an adjusted 94. I didn't write down my times, but think my score with unadjusted times would have been in the high 80s.

    I do think the longer par times took off a little bit of the mental pressure, so may have helped my accuracy. Since I want high accountability for shots fired, I'm not sure that's a bad thing. Starting the session with Chuck Pressburg's "No Fail" drill may have helped, too (even though I only got two hits in the black within the par time.)

    Continuing the accuracy theme, I finished with the FBI Bullseye course, which I tanked by going way too fast at 15 yards, for a final score of 236. (On the first timed-fire stage, I shot a nice 2" group at 6 o'clock in the 7 ring. Move it up 3" and I would have scored 251.)

  5. #115
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    Wilson combat


  6. #116
    The more I shoot this test, the more I like it. I’m quite happy with some variation of it as a cold standard. If I can get to the point where I can clean it, I’ll probably up the difficulty a little bit by shrinking the target/scoring zones. I generally score in the high 90s.
    My posts only represent my personal opinion and do not necessarily reflect the opinions or official policies of any employer, past or present. Obvious spelling errors are likely the result of an iPhone keyboard.

  7. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by JCN View Post
    The observations in the video about electronic timing and concealment are exactly consistent with the discussion here. Scoring as per the IDPA target is a little easier, though. Thanks for posting.

  8. #118
    Member John Hearne's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    I'm really liking this as well. I think the IDPA is a bit too generous. The legal paper with 7" circle is a really good alternative.

    I was asked about what to do if you only had 30 rounds to practice with. I suggested running 5 Yard Roundup, The Test, and The Bakersfield Qual. Those 30 rounds cover a lot.
    • It's not the odds, it's the stakes.
    • If you aren't dry practicing every week, you're not serious.....
    • "Tache-Psyche Effect - a polite way of saying 'You suck.' " - GG

  9. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by John Hearne View Post
    I'm really liking this as well. I think the IDPA is a bit too generous. The legal paper with 7" circle is a really good alternative.

    I was asked about what to do if you only had 30 rounds to practice with. I suggested running 5 Yard Roundup, The Test, and The Bakersfield Qual. Those 30 rounds cover a lot.
    I usually look to shoot 50-75 rounds, and it looks a lot like that. If I'm carrying a snubby I might substitute the Wizard Drill and Snubby Super Test, and if I'm struggling with pure marksmanship issues I may add the FBI bullseye course, Vickers 300, or Dave Spaulding's Fade Back drill.

    If I've been getting to the range regularly and have the time and ammo and a friend to train with, I'll shoot something sporty like one of the D Platoon quals. I also like Justin Dyal's 10-round Assault Course, but ever since I shot a 99 on it I'm not sure I ever want to try it again.

  10. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Hearne View Post
    I'm really liking this as well. I think the IDPA is a bit too generous. The legal paper with 7" circle is a really good alternative.

    I was asked about what to do if you only had 30 rounds to TEST with. I suggested running 5 Yard Roundup, The Test, and The Bakersfield Qual. Those 30 rounds cover a lot.
    Fixed that for you!

    Test versus train is a very important distinction a la this thread:

    https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....=1#post1403912

    My personal opinion is that people should nail down their index, transitions and draws in dry fire.

    That leaves basic recoil management and shot tracking for live fire.

    So if I have 30 live fire rounds to train, I’m going to work on doubles and gear changes.

    If I have 30 live fire rounds to test, I might do something that confirms what I think I can do dry and then be done with it. Usually something like Garcia dots or some other timed speed vision test.

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