COVID-19 vaccines: medical concerns and recommendations

[0ddl0t]

Masking while vaccinated timeline:

March 8, 2021

Fully vaccinated people can visit with other fully vaccinated people indoors without wearing a mask or physical distancing.

https://www.businessinsider.com/cdc-...ople-do-2021-3

May 13, 2021

Anyone who is fully vaccinated can participate in indoor or outdoor activities, large or small, without wearing a mask or physical distancing. If you are fully vaccinated, you can start doing the things that you had stopped doing because of the pandemic.

https://www.businessinsider.com/cdc-...-places-2021-5

June 25, 2021:

As we have we been saying, and Paulina this is super important, vaccine alone won’t stop the community transmission and we need to ensure that people follow the public health measures that Dr Maria Van Kerkhove was speaking today. People need to continue to use masks consistently, be in ventilated spaces, hand hygiene, respiratory etiquette, the physical distance, avoid crowding.

https://www.who.int/publications/m/i...--25-june-2021

July 27, 2021:

Today, we have new science related to the delta variant that requires us to update the guidance regarding what you can do when you are fully vaccinated.
...
In areas with substantial and high transmission, CDC recommends fully vaccinated people wear masks in public, indoor settings to help prevent the spread of the delta variant, and protect others.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/07/27/cdc-...hot-spots.html

[GyroF-16]

Masking while vaccinated timeline:

March 8, 2021
https://www.businessinsider.com/cdc-...ople-do-2021-3

May 13, 2021
https://www.businessinsider.com/cdc-...-places-2021-5

June 25, 2021:
https://www.who.int/publications/m/i...--25-june-2021

July 27, 2021:
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/07/27/cdc-...hot-spots.html

Which brings up another question of scientific fact vs. public policy…

Has anyone seen a well-executed, peer-reviewed study that quantifies the effectiveness of masks (other than well-fitted N95) in reducing the spread of any of the COVID-19 variants?

I haven’t looked in a few months, but when I did, I couldn’t find any.

[TGS]

Which brings up another question of scientific fact vs. public policy…

Has anyone seen a well-executed, peer-reviewed study that quantifies the effectiveness of masks (other than well-fitted N95) in reducing the spread of any of the COVID-19 variants?

I haven’t looked in a few months, but when I did, I couldn’t find any.

I believe 0ddl0t has posted several times about such.

[Bio]

I’m glad you understood it at the time (not snark).
I followed the reporting (no medical background, but literate, and fairly well educated), and I was under the impression that vaccines prevented or reduced transmission until only a few months ago.
In addition, 6 months ago in my state, most businesses had signs on the door saying “Masks are required unless you are vaccinated.”
I stayed in several hotels around the country last month with similar signs.
My company’s contact tracing and quarantine policies were different for vaccinated vs unvaccinated until this week.

ETA - Hell, the nation’s leader even went to television and told us that it was our patriotic duty to get vaccinated to help stop the spread.

So I won’t dispute the facts of when the benefits of vaccines were known.
But those facts seemed to rarely affect public policy, which likely contributed to widespread misunderstandings which are only now coming to light as Omicron very plainly spreads regardless of vaccines.

ETA - to be clear - I intend no political slant to my post, and am not opposed to vaccines. Just pointing out WHY so many people have believed that vaccines slowed or prevented transmission for such a long time.

I think some of this disconnect comes from the difference between "vaccinated can still transmit and get sick, but the odds are some % lower" and "vaccinated cannot transmit and get sick". They can look like the same things in public policy, but and have similar results on policy, but not be the same thing.

As for recommendations changing, well, the disease changes. A changing situation changes the tactics one uses.

[Erik]

I think some of this disconnect comes from the difference between "vaccinated can still transmit and get sick, but the odds are some % lower" and "vaccinated cannot transmit and get sick". They can look like the same things in public policy, but and have similar results on policy, but not be the same thing.

As for recommendations changing, well, the disease changes. A changing situation changes the tactics one uses.

The assessment has consistently been "vaccinated can still transmit and get sick, but the odds are some % lower" but the "some %" part has shifted over time, pretty dramatically in my view, and the messaging around that has been handled badly almost universally.

[0ddl0t]

Has anyone seen a well-executed, peer-reviewed study that quantifies the effectiveness of masks (other than well-fitted N95) in reducing the spread of any of the COVID-19 variants?

Not the variants specifically, but there were at least 3 credible studies showing masks had a positive effect. None of them were super well-executed since it isn't exactly ethical to use rigid control groups and knowingly expose people to a virus, but they looked back after the fact.


1) Arizona schools that had mask mandates had far fewer outbreaks last fall. Among the problems with this study are the fact that masked schools were open in person for fewer days and covered higher socioeconomic districts (where presumably more of their parents were working remotely). Delta was spreading during this study.

2) Midwest jurisdictions with masks mandates in early 2020 had ~200,000 fewer cases than would otherwise be expected, according to a University of Iowa study. The main problem with that study is that those jurisdictions also tended to implement other measures, like lockdowns.

3) A Bangladesh study found ~10% reduction in covid transmission by encouraging mask wearing. Among the problems is that the participation rate remained low - less than 30% of those encouraged wore masks initially and that number declined throughout the trial (vs ~10% of the control group wearing masks). This was during delta I believe

[RoyGBiv]

Here's a question that I don't believe has been pondered here......

If you are vaccinated and later (intimately) exposed to a COVID confirmed person, but never present any symptoms and test negative, does such exposure enhance your natural immune response?

Example: Daughters BF (they live together) was symptomatic, tested positive twice, now negative (7 days after testing positive first time). Isolation not possible in a small apartment. Daughter tested twice during the week, both negative. No symptoms.

Would that close contact result in any COVID immune system reinforcement?

[4RNR]

I'll believe them when they go back and explain everything from the very beginning. For example....why is it COVID bad a rallies but irrelevant at riots? Why are paper towels or the blue Chinese masks ok as face coverings? Why is the definition of vaccinated keep getting changed? Why did India, after talking to Biden, decide not to disclose what's in the medical packages they were handing out? Why all the lies about children?

Just one of many many questions I have.

Until then they can beg, plead, cry and threaten all they want.

[LittleLebowski]

Let’s keep it strictly technical.

[breakingtime91]

I agree there's plenty of reasons to be pissed about how this all has been communicated and implemented. I never did believe the folks claiming that the vaccinated couldn't spread it. Honestly, the only thing I did believe was that the vax would go a long way to preventing severe disease. Plenty enough reason by itself for me and my family to get vaccinated.

I'll refrain from further comment that's more appropriate for the politics thread.

^ this is my point. I am glad the vaccine is helping and my I wanted my Mom who is high risk to get it. My disgruntlement is around the fact that vaccinated people in my area believe they can't spread it and it has caused a huge head ache for us. I 100% agree that the vaccine helps reduce illness and death. I just wish they would come out and remind people that even though they are vaccinated, they can still spread the virus. Many don't think they can.