Any input on Les Baer?
Any input on Les Baer?
Meh. Their custom service has never been known as being stellar. You get built the gun Les thinks you should have and if you disagree with him or your gun doesn't work generally it must be your fault. Their frame is a slightly odd dimension compared to Colt and what has become standard in the 1911 circles and they way they hard fit their barrels often causes the barrel feet to crack or chip off.Originally Posted by Mark D
A really good 1911 smith once told me when I asked him about Baer, "They make a decent base gun."
Mark, if you are in Orange County, you can shoot my Baer, then decide.
I'm a bit north of you, but I'll ping you if I get down to OC. Thanks, that's a generous offer!
Yeah, but it will still be a Glock. There's the one in the museum that went to 348k, if I remember right, before structural failure.
Then there's the 290,xxx-round USP .45 that was a Federal (?) ammo test gun.
And someone else on this site once posted claiming to have bought a USP 9mm ammo company test gun with a documented 485k rounds through it, and had taken it the rest of the way past half a million. And it was still going strong.
I think they're the champions of semi-auto handgun longevity.
But the "170k of .357 and we got tired of counting so we stopped" test with the Manurhin isn't shabby.
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Not another dime.
I have owned 4 Springfields:
A loaded full size stainless. 45acp.
A Lightweight Champion. 45acp.
Both ran great for $500-900 guns.
Now I own 2 of the Range Officer series, both Champions. [Commander sized, 4" bbl.] Both are 9mm.
The original RO was purchased in '17, and I had a local smith add an ambi safety because of my lefty-ness. It has run flawless in the time I have owned it. Zero malfunctions, but the Springer mags, well, they suck. Ed Brown 9 round mags run perfect.
The second RO is the Elite in the Champion size. It too has been flawless, in the rounds I put thru it. It has become my EDC.
The original RO has the parkerized finish, which is very durable, the Elite has the Birdsong Black-T, which while durable, is already showing holster wear around the muzzle from carry in the Tenicor Certum. Certainly nothing to be worried about.
I looked into the DW series, as well as thinking about just going with 1 higher end 1911, such as Wilson or Alchemy. So far, the RO's have been great. It's a shame that Springfield eliminated everything in the Elite series except for the 10mm, because it's alot of gun for the money spent.
There's a boatload of info over on https://www.1911addicts.com/, worth looking there as well.
"... And miles to go before I sleep".
I can affirm what Kev said 100%. My trigger guard on mine was way oversized and wouldn’t fit my holsters. I had a friend mill mine to be what other 1911s were. Also, mine is a 9mm (game gun only). The follower was jumping the slide stop and the mag would stick in the gun. Measuring the slide stop, it matched a .45 slide stop. My conversation with Les boiled down to:
1. You have the correct slide stop.
2. You have to use the one mag that came with the gun (despite me telling him the problem DID occur with his magazine).
3. The gun works with the mag it came with an You’re (me) wrong.
4. You need to bend the follower tab out on other mags to engage the slide stop (despite most premium mags no longer use this style follower).
After the call, I ordered a Wilson 9 mm slide stop and problem solved.
How about Ed Brown?
I had a Special Forces model years ago. I believe it was their answer to the then-still-newish Wilson CQB?
https://www.edbrown.com/product/bo-18-special-forces/
IIRC it was also, like the CQB, about $1k less at that time…
Does the above offend? If you have paid to be here, you can click here to put it in context.
I recently purchased a DW Specialist vs the WC ACP. Being my first 1911 (and likely only 1911) I wanted to have no regrets. I really respect Wilson Combat and have upgraded my Beretta 92A1 with many high quality steel parts (hammer, trigger, guide rod, springs, etc). This forum had great recommendations about DW. I started out wanting to spend $1000 but wound up spending $1850 on Specialist (10mm). When I was comparing the WC ACP feature for feature here is what I noticed. The Specialist had these features that were absent on the ACP: ambi safety, much better beveled mag well, front cocking serrations on slide, machined grooves rib top of slide, tritium night sights. And I prefer a stainless finish for appearance and elimination of finish wearing off, which is not available on ACP.
Now I am assuming of course that the DW is nearly as good as the WC, which may not be true. But I have read about some problems with WC pistols. I really wanted to get a WC but at the end of the day, I would have spent $2600 (vs $1850) for a pistol I would not have liked as much (assuming no problems with DW). I originally was looking at 9mm in both but decided I wanted a 10mm to have deer hunt option. The WC ACP is not available in 10mm but that is not the point I wanted to make.
In summary I guess the WC ACP is considered a “custom quality” pistol and the Dan Wesson is considered a “semi custom” pistol and that is the accepted difference in price. Or the Wilson products are considered higher quality across the board? I understand the test target is included with Wilson pistols and that is impressive as to their quality control before release. However some have still reported issues. Both companies have reputations to resolve issues that will inevitably arise with a few pistols. The advice I got here on Pistol Forum is what guided me to a Dan Wesson vs less expensive alternatives. I really appreciate the all steel parts aspect of DW as well. This post has to do with “how to decide when to spend more $$”, not less. The overwhelming feedback I read is that there are diminishing returns on spending more than a DW costs. For guys where money is no object and they just want a full custom experience, I get it but that’s not me, now.
Avoid the Comanche and Stinger guns unless you plan on sending the NIB gun to a good smith as Baer uses Government Model frame geometry, not Commander. The result is less slide travel and an increase in stoppages. The frame bridge can be machined to Government Model specs by a good smith, but that necessitates a refinish. If you buy one, get it used so someone else takes the depreciation hit, and you are not tempted to use the Baer warranty.
The five-inch guns tend to run once the round count exceeds 1,000. The barrel fit is very hard and can result in barrel springing or broken lugs. The frames and slides are nice, the barrel is a private-labeled unit from Fred Kart, and the small parts are not the best. The bluing is thin but does protect the metal.
I must admit to liking the Baer heavyweight frames as the extra weight in the dustcover reduces muzzle flip while the recoil system is GI standard. Now that there are holsters for full-length rails, the Baer Monolith Heavyweight can be holstered. Not sure I would do so as the extra weight on the hip might be noticeable, but it is nice to have the option.
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