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Thread: The 32 ACP Field Pistol

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Haggard View Post
    I've given this a lot of thought;
    https://www.henryusa.com/caliber/327...num-32-hr-mag/
    Because a friend has one and it feeds H&Rs and Longs fine.

    Pair it with this;
    https://ruger.com/products/sp101/specSheets/5773.html


    A friend has one of these in .32-20, and his is a take down gun. I never knew I needed such a thing until I saw his. Haven't been able to find one for myself yet.
    https://www.gunvaluesboard.com/remin...l-25-1837.html
    If the Henry works with longs and magnums then it just jumped way up on my want list. I have a 1912 vintage Marlin in .32-20, but longs and magnums are quieter and easier to reload.

    Those Remington 25s are awesome! I always wanted on but have never seen one around here except a rough one in .25-20. I always thought that a Remington 14 in .38-40 or .44-40 would be super cool also and would have been a really cool option for a saddle gun / patrol rifle back in the day.

    There is an image of one of the later Police Positives over on wiki actually : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:C...ecialCal38.jpg

    I picked up a Savage Sporter bolt action in .32-20 a couple years back and it is a lot of fun. Long and elegant, and pretty close to a 22 in report volume when loaded with mild cowboy loads: https://www.savageshooters.com/showt...-32-20-Sporter

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Haggard View Post
    I've given this a lot of thought;
    https://www.henryusa.com/caliber/327...num-32-hr-mag/
    Because a friend has one and it feeds H&Rs and Longs fine.

    A friend has one of these in .32-20, and his is a take down gun. I never knew I needed such a thing until I saw his. Haven't been able to find one for myself yet.
    https://www.gunvaluesboard.com/remin...l-25-1837.html
    A buddy's wife claimed their .327 levergun for her side of the bed where she can provide overwatch for the chickens. I only got to play with it early on during break-in with whatever ammo was on hand. It shot well and seemed accurate as any Henry but had the usual feeding bobbles with some bullet profiles.

    And I think I might want that model 25 as much or more than a Dreyse light carbine:
    https://youtu.be/mFdKixQ5fGY

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by SCCY Marshal View Post
    A buddy's wife claimed their .327 levergun for her side of the bed where she can provide overwatch for the chickens. I only got to play with it early on during break-in with whatever ammo was on hand. It shot well and seemed accurate as any Henry but had the usual feeding bobbles with some bullet profiles.

    And I think I might want that model 25 as much or more than a Dreyse light carbine:
    https://youtu.be/mFdKixQ5fGY
    The Dreyse Light Carbine's are just too nifty. I played with one at Collector's Firearms back in 2018. Very funky little gun.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by revolvergeek View Post
    Those Remington 25s are awesome! I always wanted on but have never seen one around here except a rough one in .25-20.

    I picked up a Savage Sporter bolt action in .32-20 a couple years back and it is a lot of fun. Long and elegant, and pretty close to a 22 in report volume when loaded with mild cowboy loads:
    One of my favorite calibers is the .25-20. Last year I picked up a Remington 25 in pretty good shape off GB in that caliber, and a private deal with a collector selling out got me two Savage 23B's (same as the Sporter) as well.

    The .25-20, while it doesn't really fit in a .32 field pistol thread, is a *great* caliber; basically an overgrown .22 that's reloadable. I don't know of anything like it in this modern world of super-efficient cartridges. And that's a shame.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Welder View Post
    One of my favorite calibers is the .25-20. Last year I picked up a Remington 25 in pretty good shape off GB in that caliber, and a private deal with a collector selling out got me two Savage 23B's (same as the Sporter) as well.

    The .25-20, while it doesn't really fit in a .32 field pistol thread, is a *great* caliber; basically an overgrown .22 that's reloadable. I don't know of anything like it in this modern world of super-efficient cartridges. And that's a shame.
    Oh I agree, but I am just trying to keep from adding new calibers into the collection these days as much as possible. I resisted .32-20 for a long time, and got out of .30 carbine and .327 mag.

  6. #66
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    The "Infamous Bunny Gun"

    John Taylor is the "go to" guy to build your Bunny Gun Of Dreams. Taking the liberty here of posting my previous article from The Fouling Shot:


    Tales From The Back Creek Diary - Testing Alliant #2400 In The “.32 Long Rifle Centerfire,” (aka .32 S&W Long)

    After having fooled around with a .32 ACP barrel on my tiny prewar H&R .44/.410 shotgun frame, I had John Taylor rechamber it to .32 S&W Long. The result has been delightful in every way. The barrel was originally fabricated from a pulled-off M1 Garand barrel, cutting off the muzzle behind the gas port and the breech at the chamber neck, turning the OD, fitting the shotgun under lug and ejector. The barrel is a 4-groove .30 cal. Government form with ten inch twist. John rechambered it with the same reamer he used when he relined my Army & Navy Cooperative Society rook rifle, so it has a proper “rifle-type” throat. I wanted to experiment with heavy bullet, subsonic loads for low noise, still being adequate to ensure through and through penetration of large varmints.

    The design objective was to produce short, 4 pound package which would stow in a rucksack taken down, approximating .32 H&R Magnum or .32-20 ballistics using .32 S&W Long loads a bit heavier than factory, but still safe for modern postwar revolvers. This was accomplished easily. XS peep sights are zeroed at 50 yards. The tiny gun produces 2 inch groups at that range, and literal bug holes at 25 yards.

    A nominal case full without compression of Alliant #2400 approximates factory .32-20 or .32 H&R Magnum velocities. Its ten-inch twist stabilizes heavy bullets with good accuracy when subsonic. If I ever needed to shoot through a cow with a .32, Accurate’s 31-134D encouraged by about 6 grains of #2400 is up to the task. The “Little Cartridge That Could” or “.32 Long Rifle Centerfire,” as I like to call it, shoots clear through both large and small varmints with equal facility, from any angle, whether it be raccoon, groundhog, or coyote.

    Since I sold my pre-war S&W I-frame .32 Hand Ejector to my good friend Steve in Arizona, all of my .32 S&W revolvers are of sturdy, modern, postwar construction. Normal operating pressure of the .32 S&W long is about 14,000 psi, whereas the SAAMI MAP for the .32 H&R Magnum is 22,500 psi. A .32 cylinder is very much thicker walled than the same cylinder would be, if it were chambered in .38 Special, and with postwar metallurgy and heat treatment is more than strong enough. Most important, the .32 case body and head diameter are smaller, so you have fewer square inches exerting that pressure in all directions. The breech thrust of a .32 S&W Long at 22,500 psi is 2475 pounbds, less than .38 Special which at 18,000 psi has 2790 pounds of thrust is the design limit of my favored late 1960s era D-frame Colts. So, yes, I do exceed factory pressures in my Bunny guns.

    Previous testing validated that Alliant #2400 shot wonderfully in the .32 Long Rifle with bullets designed for the .32-20. I needed to test it more thoroughly in revolvers. Having increased cylinder length as in modern D-frame Colts permits seating heavier bullets out in S&W Long brass to increase powder capacity. Previously I had very mixed results, with unburned powder and poor ballistic uniformity using #2400 with 98-grain .32 revolver bullets. It requires heavier bullets to builkd enough pressure >16,000 psi to produce a clean burn. I had good results with the Saeco #322 bullet (122 grains) seated to 1.32” overall length in .32 S&W Long brass, crimping in the top lube groove, using either 2 grains of Bullseye or 6 grains of #2400. Either load would shoot an inch and half at 50 yards with iron sights over a long series from the Bunny Gun and was fully acceptable in my revolvers. After a few more years of tinkering I became less timid and tried a series of heavier 125-155-grain bullets which Tom at Accurate Molds made for me, using #2400 powder in the rifle, and establishing that they were also acceptable for revolver use.

    My general purpose revolver load for post-WW2 .32 S&W Long revolvers and the single-shot H&R uses 2.5 grains of Bullseye with either the 115-gr. Ideal #3118 or Accurate 31-114D. I cast these of soft scrap, 10BHN, tumble in Lee Liquid Alox, size .314, loading in .32 S&W Long cases with Federal 200 primers. The equivalent charge of Alliant #2400 to approximate the Bullseye load is 5.6 grains, not to be exceeded in pre-1957 S&Ws or older Colts.

    In a strong, modern revolver the charge with #2400 can be increased to as much as the case will comfortably "gently" hold without compression, 6.3 grains in Remington brass. Increasing bullet weight by loading either the Accurate 125D and 134D bullets over the same 6.3 grain charge compresses the powder and improves ballistic uniformity with excellent accuracy at pressures approximating the .32 H&R Magnum. While these loads have not been pressure tested they are quite safe in the Rugers chambered for .32 H&R Magnum, if you want to exploit readily available .32 S&W Long brass, and in post-1957 S&W Models 30 and 31, D-frame Colts of the same era and other strong, modern .32 revolvers, giving about 1200 fps in an 18” rifle barrel.

    A flat-nosed, solid lead bullet, with large meplat at subsonic velocity is fully adequate in energy and penetration against feral dogs or coyotes. The 6.3 grain charge of Alliant #2400 gives a flatter trajectory to reach out to 100 yards or more from the rifle at the expense of a bit more noise than the milder, subsonic load. Revolver energies approach standard pressure .38 Specials! Indeed Alliant #2400 worked better for me in the .32 Long Rifle than it does in the .32 H&R Magnum, in which maximum charges leave excessive airspace, which impairs its ballistic uniformity. Heavier bullets work better.

    So goes this encore in search of “Bunny Gun Nirvanna….” Now to walk the garden., Wherrrrrre….. arrrrrre…. Yoooooou…. Nooow…Mister. Waaaaaaaaaabbit?


    Test of .32 S&W Long Factory Loads Vs. Alliant #2400 In Revolvers and Rifle
    Remington cases, Federal 200 primers in all handloads:

    Ammo Type________________Colt 2”__________Colt 4”___________H&R18”

    PMC 98 LRN factory_________687, 13 Sd_______797, 17Sd________945, 16 Sd
    Highest velocity factory load__103 ft-lbs._______138 ft.lbs.________194 ft.-lbs.

    Federal 98 LRN factory_______n/f_____________729, 12 Sd________884, 35 Sd

    Remington 98 LRN__________n/f_____________643, 24 Sd________825, 17 Sd

    Accurate 31-114D, 2.5 BE____746, 9 Sd________795, 15 Sd________947, 11 Sd
    Max. for pre-1957 revolvers__141ft.-lbs.________160 ft.-lbs.________227 ft.-lbs.

    Accurate 31-114D, 5.6 #2400__735, 33Sd_______811, 27 Sd________1083, 38 Sd Do Not Exceed in pre-1957 S&Ws or Colts!

    Accurate 31-114D, 6.3 #2400__768, 22Sd_______839, 37 Sd________1205, 22 Sd Full-charge load for post-1957 S&Ws and Colts

    Accurate 31-125D, 6.3 #2400__820, 19Sd_______890 19 Sd_________1240, 29 Sd
    Some unburned powder, good accuracy, no signs of high pressure.

    Accurate 31-134D, 6.3 #2400__828, 19 Sd_______913, 16 Sd________1221, 16 Sd
    Max. for postwar D-frame Colts_204 ft.-lbs._______248 ft.-lbs._________443 ft.-lbs.!
    Ejected cases fall out easily, clean burn, accurate, recoil similar to .38 Special +P.
    Accurate in the rifle! Shoots to the sights at 50 yards in the revolver! This one is “it”.
    __________________________________________________ ____________________

  7. #67
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    Another previously published article of mine from The Fouling Shot

    Tales from the Back Creek Diary – A .32 ACP Rifle - Be verrrry, verrrry quiiiiiet, so not to scare the bunny wabbits!

    I felt that for low noise small game and garden varmint shooting the tiny .32 ACP case would have advantages. Having a .32 ACP rifle also fit into my “what would Harry have done?” plan to have a long gun adapted to each handgun caliber I use in quantity. The only way to get a real handy (and hopefully accurate) .32 ACP rifle is to build your own.

    I saw on the Internet that centerfire conversions were being done successfully to adapt the Remington 580-series .22 bolt-actions to rimless pistol cartridges. . I found a Remington 580 single-shot and sent it to Andy Owens for conversion. Andy used a pinned barrel, instead of threading the receiver, as would be done for the 7.62x25, because this would simplify the work. He used a 10 inch Douglas .30 cal. blank to ensure adequate projectile stability in subsonic loads, as well as to permit my experimenting with heavier bullets.

    Fabricating a center-fire .32 ACP bolt action is more complex (pronounced expensive) than simply making another barrel to fit your H&R single-shot. It requires making a new bolt head and all that goes with it. Andy chose not enlarge the ejection port, because this was unnecessary with the tiny .32 ACP cartridge, omitting this step was done to reduce cost, the same logic I applied in not using a threaded barel. This way the rifle could be restored back to .22 LR I ever wanted to do so.

    Barrel length is 22 inches. A 2 grain load of Bulleye with the Accurate 31-087T, or the 82-gr. hollowpoint conversion the same bullet were most accurate, but slightly noisy because some rounds go supersonic in the rifle barrel. While my I stuck with 2 grains of Bullseye with the 82-gr. cast hollowpoint to ensure good bullet expansion, with the 87-grain solids I have standardized on the minimum charge which reliably cycles my Beretta 81, 1.7 grs. of Bullseye which gets 850 f.p.s. from the rifle with inch groups at 25 yds. Report is similar to standard velocity .22 LR from sporting rifle. No crack, only a pop and smack when bullet hits.

    Using ordinary handgun ammunition grouping is an inch at 25 yards and in proportion to 50 yards, which seems to be the practical accuracy limit. You have to decide whether you want a bunny gun as a fun plinker, easier to shoot accurately than a handgun and useable for small game with ordinary handgun loads at modest range, or if you will use specialized ammo which won’t work in your handgun, which I feel defeats the purpose. I rationalize this by being frugal, wanting to save any .32 ACP brass I fire from my handgun in the woods. My “.30 cal. CB cap load” of 1 grain of Bullseye or TiteGroup is accurate and can be manually cycled in most pistols. Velocity is about 600 f.p.s. in the rifle and 450 fps in my Colt M1903 Pocket Model or CZ27, as quiet as firing subsonic .22 LR in a Ruger Mk. III with a "can".

    In the ten-inch twist barrel the 115-grain Ideal 3118 can be seated to fit into the pistol magazine will chamber and stabilize, but available powder capacity is greatly reduced due to bullet base intrusion into the case. To avoid high pressure use no more than 1 grain of Bullseye. As little as ˝ grain will exit the barrel and give good accuracy to 50 feet and is no louder or faster than an air rifle.

    A .32 ACP rifle follows true to form of the other bunny guns delivering inch 5-shot groups at 25 yards and in proportion at 50 yards. A scope makes groups more consistent, but ammo quality is the limiting factor. Remember that .22 rimfire bullets are soft, seal the bore well, well lubricated, and used in light, low pressure loads with fast burning powder. I have tried to maintain those parameters in my Bunnygun loads and have always done best when I did. . These guns are not as accurate as a .22 LR shooting match ammo. The quality of swaged bullets assembled into .22 LR rimfire ammo is much better in terms of roundness, dimensional uniformity and lack of voids, but the .32 is effective on small game at modest ranges, and is sure pleasant and fun to shoot.

    Full charge .32 ACP loads with the 90-grain Hornady .309" diameter with 3 grains of AutoComp give 1330 fps from the rifle and blow up woodchucks about as well as 7.62x25 loads from my TT33 or Cz52 pistols.

  8. #68
    What’s the consensus on the HK4 as a .32 acp plinker? I found one for a good price, but won’t get a chance to check it out in person.

    Are they as good, or better than the competition? Reading online, it sounds like these have +/- 20 lb DA trigger pulls, but how is the SA? I like the option to convert it to .22 LR.

    Also, how’s the accuracy?

    I know I could bet a .22 LCP for a fraction of the price, but where’s the fun in that?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by john c View Post
    WhatÂ’s the consensus on the HK4 as a .32 acp plinker? I found one for a good price, but wonÂ’t get a chance to check it out in person.

    Are they as good, or better than the competition? Reading online, it sounds like these have +/- 20 lb DA trigger pulls, but how is the SA? I like the option to convert it to .22 LR.

    Also, howÂ’s the accuracy?

    I know I could bet a .22 LCP for a fraction of the price, but whereÂ’s the fun in that?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    As much as I like the idea of them I personally did not have good luck with them. The first one I owned back in the early 90s I had 380 and 22 kits for. It worked pretty well is a 22 as long as you kept it clean but it was not generally reliable with anything other than warmer FMJ 380. Unfortunately being a sort of copy of an HsC and alloy framed it was really unpleasant to shoot with that stuff and I got rid of it. The second I had maybe 7-8 years back I had 32 and 22 sets for and it was just the opposite. I never could get it to go through a full mag of 22 ammo without a jam. They have a polymer recoil buffer in the frame that has to be replaced over time and if you donÂ’t then the frame can break there. I bought a third one that had broken like that from being shot without the buffer for parts to have spares for the .32/22, but finally I got tired of messing with it and sold it to a buddy of mine who just likes having it and doesnÂ’t shoot it.

    I have a lot more experience with 32 revolvers then automatics. The old savages generally work well and are fun. I had Astra 300 that worked well but was heavy and pointed terribly because of the grip angle but at least it had easy to see sights. probably my favorite ever was a Sauer 38H; great feel, decent sights, super cool cocking/docking lever, but didnÂ’t like anything other than rn fmj. A buddy of mine picked up an Manhurian PP and it turned out way nicer than expected with a decent trigger but tiny sights. Personally I really like the idea of a PP with custom sights. Would like to try a Beretta 70s in .32 one day. I have had a couple in 22 and they run like sewing machines.
    Last edited by revolvergeek; 05-19-2021 at 10:10 PM.

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by revolvergeek View Post
    As much as I like the idea of them I personally did not have good luck with them. The first one I owned back in the early 90s I had 380 and 22 kits for. It worked pretty well is a 22 as long as you kept it clean but it was not generally reliable with anything other than warmer FMJ 380. Unfortunately being a sort of copy of an HsC and alloy framed it was really unpleasant to shoot with that stuff and I got rid of it. The second I had maybe 7-8 years back I had 32 and 22 sets for and it was just the opposite. I never could get it to go through a full mag of 22 ammo without a jam. They have a polymer recoil buffer in the frame that has to be replaced over time and if you donÂ’t then the frame can break there. I bought a third one that had broken like that from being shot without the buffer for parts to have spares for the .32/22, but finally I got tired of messing with it and sold it to a buddy of mine who just likes having it and doesnÂ’t shoot it.

    I have a lot more experience with 32 revolvers then automatics. The old savages generally work well and are fun. I had Astra 300 that worked well but was heavy and pointed terribly because of the grip angle but at least it had easy to see sights. probably my favorite ever was a Sauer 38H; great feel, decent sights, super cool cocking/docking lever, but didnÂ’t like anything other than rn fmj. A buddy of mine picked up an Manhurian PP and it turned out way nicer than expected with a decent trigger but tiny sights. Personally I really like the idea of a PP with custom sights. Would like to try a Beretta 70s in .32 one day. I have had a couple in 22 and they run like sewing machines.
    Thanks for the update on the HK4. I thought/feared as much, but I’m a sucker for convertible guns.

    I have a couple of Beretta 70 series .32 acp. Specifically the 6 inch target models to get around the GCA 68 restrictions. They’re really fun. Back when .22 lr was outrageous and primers were cheap it really made sense as a reloadable .22 substitute.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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