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Thread: Precise looking vs precise aiming

  1. #31
    IF you need to shoot at a long distance or small target, with open sights focus on the front sight just like if you are shooting bullseye. With a dot focus on the target regardless. Close range at a larger target it doesn't matter, I usually don't even notice the rear sight, front sight more as a reference, kind of point shooting but I do see the front sight. Easy peasy.

  2. #32
    I do believe that precise aiming is a fundamental to practical pistol shooting. I have been working on this a lot in dry fire. Currently I’m taping the front of my dot and it seems to help me focus more on a specific point and not the dot. I’ll also practice this without a gun sometimes while I’m at a stop light. I’ll pick 4 or 5 objects and points on those objects and switch my vision between them as fast as I can. I do believe this is a skill that has to be trained. It doesn’t come natural for me.
    "Shooting is 90% mental. The rest is in your head." -Nils

  3. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by JCS View Post
    . I’ll pick 4 or 5 objects and points on those objects and switch my vision between them as fast as I can. I do believe this is a skill that has to be trained. It doesn’t come natural for me.
    Gabe talks about this in class as part of his eye training. I did it around the office a little after class but haven’t in ages.

  4. #34
    Site Supporter rdtompki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rdtompki View Post
    I'd like to offer a different spin on this discussion in case there are old folks still shooting irons post cataract surgery hereabouts. I'm an average shooter but wife and I, both in our mid-70's, are still dedicated to steel challenge. Some of the lighting conditions are very challenging. When I developed cataracts 4 years ago I tried every manner of lens color to no avail and for a time used my non-dominant eye (ugh!). Following cataract surgery I'm better than 20/20 and have been using prescription glasses, distance left eye and 26"/front sight focus right eye.

    Obviously, I can't refocus my right eye and when poor contrast plates are out past 20 yards I really loose lock on the sights struggling to discern the aim point. I had been considering trying a more distant focus to improve target contrast at the expense of front sight clarity. I was at the range today helping my wife sight in one of her nefarious 22lr competition guns (invention of the devil I say) and at the end I got out my 9mm 1911 and ran through 2 magazines at an 18 yard target wearing my PCC glasses which are distant focus in both eyes. The target was crystal clear and despite a very slight fuzz on the sights I had no trouble aligning same. Granted, the target contrast was pretty good, but I'm always able to clearly see even poor contrast targets at distance with my left eye with monovision a distant focus. Monday's match at 4pm with some horrible backgrounds and no over the shoulder sun will tell the tale, but I see this as a potential breakthrough.

    I think what I'm doing with external means (the glasses) has a parallel in early parts of this discussion, the difference being that you relative youngsters are using software while I need hardware assist (the glasses).
    Update (since I can't edit): The experiment is over having confirmed the hypothesis. Even under bad lighting conditions I can see the targets clearly and despite a slight loss of resolution at the iron sight distance I have no trouble aligning the sights and getting hits. Why the improvement? I could see the targets prior to this change. I could hit the targets reliably in static engagement. I believe increased target contrast greatly improves the accuracy of my transitions. There's a control loop involved that uses vision to drive the gun to the target; it isn't all muscle memory even in Steel Challenge. Human visual acuity decreases fairly rapidly as a function of angle relative to the center of the eye's visual field. Couple that with low contrast targets and this wonderful control loop doesn't produce a good sight picture when the gun arrives on target. I'm experiencing better sight pictures as I arrive on target and naturally a better focus on the POI due to improved target resolution. Now only one set of specialty glasses to buy for both irons and optics!

  5. #35
    Deadeye Dick Clusterfrack's Avatar
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    Here's a good Instagram video by Ben Stoeger that discusses some of the things in this thread.
    "You can never have too many knives." --Joe Ambercrombie
    Shabbat shalom, motherf***ers! --Mordechai Jefferson Carver

  6. #36
    I thought this was appropriate to the discussion.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9AYcRox-Ts

  7. #37
    Deadeye Dick Clusterfrack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by octagon View Post
    I thought this was appropriate to the discussion.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9AYcRox-Ts
    I liked some of that video. But I didn’t understand what he was talking about with using the rear sight as the primary aiming device. I also wish he would have talked more about the importance of looking at a small spot on the target. Just being target focused isn’t enough.
    "You can never have too many knives." --Joe Ambercrombie
    Shabbat shalom, motherf***ers! --Mordechai Jefferson Carver

  8. #38
    Yeah not very detailed or how to but interesting take from an experienced competitor with some discussion on various ways some use focus and sights together. Hopefully there will be more detailed discussions in the future. It is just another data point in confirmation of the validity of the technique.

  9. #39
    Deadeye Dick Clusterfrack's Avatar
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    Precise looking vs precise aiming

    This approach continues to yield excellent results for me. Yesterday at practice I shot the USPSA classifier CM18-07. For Production, the hit factors needed are: HHF: 8.66HF; GM: 8.23HF. M: 7.36HF.

    36 pts (-2C) in 4.25s or 34 points (3C) 4.13s are good goals for GM runs, and in the past I’ve struggled to do this—let alone consistently. I was either too many points down, or took too long guaranteeing A's. This time, I was focused intensely on a small spot on each target and consistently shot 36 to 38 points on each run. Precise looking yielded especially good results for me on the partial target, with at least 1 A on each run and no hits in the white. I found the exercise mentally/visually fatiguing, and I wasn't able to keep it up very long. I think that's a side effect of doing 'precise looking'.

    Here are 6 runs. I started on the left steel, and reloaded on the right open target:
    .93, .26, 1.24, .19, .46, .24, .36, .27: 3.95s -1C. 38pts. 9.62HF 111%
    1.04, .32, 1.40, .17, .48, .23, .36, .41: 4.41s -1C. 8.6HF 99.4%
    8.03HF 93%
    8.74HF 101%
    8.20HF 94.6%
    8.144HF 94%
    Fucked 2 reloads in a row. Getting visually fatigued… time to stop.

    "You can never have too many knives." --Joe Ambercrombie
    Shabbat shalom, motherf***ers! --Mordechai Jefferson Carver

  10. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Clusterfrack View Post
    I found the exercise mentally/visually fatiguing, and I wasn't able to keep it up very long. I think that's a side effect of doing 'precise looking'.
    I find closing my eyes and rolling them back in my head during an in breath helpful. There are a bunch of different vision relaxation techniques that are probably highly personal in effectiveness.

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