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Thread: 1911 series 70 vs 80 question

  1. #61
    Revolvers Revolvers 1911s Stephanie B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TGS View Post
    but...but...but...how?

    Was Condition 3 with the 1911 different than Condition 3 of current day? Should just be a mag inserted with no manipulation of the slide, how on earth did they end up NDing?
    The procedure for changing the watch involved handing over the gun and holster. The guy going off watch would draw, rack the gun, point it in a safe direction and pull the trigger. Since everyone was used to carrying it empty, few really checked the chamber.

    So they did that and two guys neglected to remove the magazine beforehand. *Bang* Each time, the ship was outboard of a certain destroyer tender, at different times. Each time, the round hit the tender.

    Both times, the sailor involved was from the same division. During a later tender availability, at the opening conference, the division officer presented the officers from the tender with a plaque that had a Purple Heart with an Oak Leaf Cluster and the dates of the NDs. Everyone thought it was funny as hell, except for the tender's new CO, who looked at his XO and muttered: "You're gonna brief be about this afterwards, aren't you, XO."
    If we have to march off into the next world, let us walk there on the bodies of our enemies.

  2. #62
    Revolvers Revolvers 1911s Stephanie B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by willie View Post
    I agree that if carrying for self defense only having a loaded chamber makes sense. Having heard many incidences where some troops can't operate a pistol safely, I think that a double action only revolver might be a better choice for applications where staff people are being issued a handgun. And, yes, I understand a revolver's limitations.
    Issuing DAO M1917s would have been a fine way to go.
    If we have to march off into the next world, let us walk there on the bodies of our enemies.

  3. #63
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    Your gun should always be pointed in a safe direction, this includes loading and unloading.


    The P250 would probably be have been a great option for a general issue firearm.

  4. #64
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    My good friend recently retired after spending 20 years in that branch of the Air Force that was once called the Air Police. He was an nco that had had small arms training duties. He complained at length about difficulties involved with teaching his charges to safely operate the Beretta 92. Further he referred to similar issues when conducting qualifications for regular troops. And we are talking about security forces!

  5. #65
    Do you think it would be helpful to specify the same manual of arms for the sidearm as the infantry rifle?

    The 1911 et seq are a good start with a safety convenient to the right thumb. You would have to have a striker or an enclosed hammer so people wouldn't be frightened by the sight of a cocked gun, as nobody seems bothered by the idea of a rifle or shotgun unobviously cocked and on safe.
    1911 and many other slide stops are best operated by the left thumb, not too far from the AR's bolt stop.

    Just put the magazine catch in reach of the right forefinger and you are all set to operate rifle and pistol similarly.
    Maybe some cocking ears on the rear of the pistol slide, too.
    Code Name: JET STREAM

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Watson View Post
    Do you think it would be helpful to specify the same manual of arms for the sidearm as the infantry rifle?

    The 1911 et seq are a good start with a safety convenient to the right thumb. You would have to have a striker or an enclosed hammer so people wouldn't be frightened by the sight of a cocked gun, as nobody seems bothered by the idea of a rifle or shotgun unobviously cocked and on safe.
    1911 and many other slide stops are best operated by the left thumb, not too far from the AR's bolt stop.

    Just put the magazine catch in reach of the right forefinger and you are all set to operate rifle and pistol similarly.
    Maybe some cocking ears on the rear of the pistol slide, too.
    You just described the M17/M18 minus the cocking ears.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by theJanitor View Post
    I prefer a gunsmith tuned s80 over a s70 pistol for my defensive needs. When tuned up right, there are negligible downsides for a CCW type weapon, with the bonus of additional safety. I've had superb s80 pistols built by Lary Vickers, Wilsons (Tripp, Phillips, Peters), Bonar at Novak's, CT Brian, etc., so I feel like I can talk from experience here.
    I have a 1991A1 worked over by EGW (back when they did that sort of thing). When I let people shoot it, they don’t believe that all the series 80s parts are intact and functional. I see no downside to the series 80s.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have a 1991A1 worked over by EGW (back when they did that sort of thing). When I let people shoot it, they don’t believe that all the series 80s parts are intact and functional. I see no downside to the series 80s.
    I've found that when it comes to standard production line Colts, S70 guns will generally have a slightly better trigger out of the box than S80 guns. But shoot any S80 gun built by the Colt Custom Shop and it becomes obvious how good they can be.

    The only minor downside to the S80 system is that the guns take a bit more time to completely disassemble and reassemble. When field stripping for cleaning there is no difference.

  9. #69
    Site Supporter Trooper224's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cory View Post
    Cool.

    If you can find a Valor I'd highly recommend it. Mine has around 1000-1300 rounds as a fun gun. They have the rounded slide top, that to me is more classic. The duty treat finish on the 2015ish models are excellent. The older ones have a "duty coat" that is more coating than actual metal treatment.

    Valor was the flagship of DW for sometime. Last I heard they disappeared from production, much like the beloved Cbob. The largely empty slide with classic lines but modern touches appealled alot to me. I have a couple 92s, a 1911, and a USGI M17. The heritage (even if updated) is not lost on me.

    I would avoid a stainless DW. I don't care for shiney guns much, and DW had issues with slide/frame galling in their stainless models. It was normally discovered early in the pistol's round count and I think mostly resolved now. None the less I remember it being often discussed in the 2015 timeframe I got my Valor.

    Mine has worked well with Wilson 47Ds, but I'd probably get ETMs moving forward. Mine is a range toy, but if it was all I had I would carry it. I like the 92 for carry, but think DW represents a sweet spot in quality/price for 1911s.

    Good luck finding one, and I hope to see it in the gallery.

    The Valor is back in the line up, but with some further enhancements. All DWs are stainless(except the A1), regardless of the Duty finish. My Valor is six years old and the Duty finish has worn like iron. It's more than worth the added expense.
    We may lose and we may win, but we will never be here again.......

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by Trooper224 View Post
    The Valor is back in the line up, but with some further enhancements. All DWs are stainless(except the A1), regardless of the Duty finish. My Valor is six years old and the Duty finish has worn like iron. It's more than worth the added expense.
    Right, I meant the non duty treat stainless. I phrased that poorly. Truly hard to photograph, and incredibly rugged.

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