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Thread: AR15 Optimal Rail Length Discussion / Fixed FSB

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by KEW8338 View Post
    Anyone who walks around with a gun. Nothing special.

    Everyone trips. Gravity wins.
    Of course, the physics makes perfect sense and I have an old upper with a 16” barrel and carbine gas tube and 7” rail and I thought I was being smart moving the light as far forward of the rail as possible so it extends past the rail. I plan to move it back onto the rail this weekend.

    I was just curious since you said you’ve seen it happen many times, if it was in the military, in law enforcement, civilian completion/classes/etc. Not doubting you, just curious where you’ve seen it if you don’t mind sharing.

  2. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanch View Post
    Of course, the physics makes perfect sense and I have an old upper with a 16” barrel and carbine gas tube and 7” rail and I thought I was being smart moving the light as far forward of the rail as possible so it extends past the rail. I plan to move it back onto the rail this weekend.

    I was just curious since you said you’ve seen it happen many times, if it was in the military, in law enforcement, civilian completion/classes/etc. Not doubting you, just curious where you’ve seen it if you don’t mind sharing.
    I don't think you would have a problem with that set-up as the barrel would probably hit the ground before the light did. Unless you fall with the rifle flat, then it wouldn't make any difference where the light was mounted on the rail.

  3. #33
    This thread needs more pics.

    I agree with @rob_s . I seem to get along just fine with a 12-14" rail and don't feel like I need "as much rail as possible". I also never run much on a rail except a light, irons, and maybe a handstop, so YMMV.

    Here's another build/config I'm working on and liking the feel of so far. 16" carbine barrel (Colt 6920 CK upper) with a Centurion C4 MLOK 12" rail (very few pics of this C4 rail length out there). I'm 6'2" and find I have plenty of rail length to get my support hand out pretty aggressively. Obviously I don't have a light or irons on it right now, but still plenty of room.

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    As far as if you still have an FSB, I can highly recommend Centurion Arms C4 or C4 MLOK rails. Easy install and they're rigid for how minimalist they are.
    “Ammo in the gun = Time in the fight.” -Paul Gomez
    “It's a shame HK isn't providing adult supervision to SIG” -JonInWA

    Co-Founder of TexasGunTalk

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanch View Post
    Of course, the physics makes perfect sense and I have an old upper with a 16” barrel and carbine gas tube and 7” rail and I thought I was being smart moving the light as far forward of the rail as possible so it extends past the rail. I plan to move it back onto the rail this weekend.

    I was just curious since you said you’ve seen it happen many times, if it was in the military, in law enforcement, civilian completion/classes/etc. Not doubting you, just curious where you’ve seen it if you don’t mind sharing.
    Walking up a rock embankment, right hand shooter, rifle slung across the front, right foot forward, left foot back. Left foot gives way, right side of rifle shears down rock embankment. Light bar gets peeled back.

    Walking through the woods, do a target transition going from left to right, rifle light impacts a small tree and bends inboard toward the barrel.

    Walking through the woods, with rifle up and hunting, fall forward, rifle is kept oriented downrange. Extended light breaks fall into tree head long. Light bar bends outboard.

    I offset anything rail mounted, behind the front/muzzle end of the rail. So in whatever conditions, when gravity takes over, I try to let the front end of the rail be the bumper, vice the potentially life supporting gear (lazer, light etc)

    Surefires are built like a brick shithouse. I have not seen one break, from something unexpected. The forward mounted light stuff runs a toll on the attachment point or the rail. Again, its a lever arm working against you. For what benefit? A little less shadow?

    Thats the same reason, I use plastic vertical foregrips and not metal ones. The plastic breaks....

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by KEW8338 View Post
    The forward mounted light stuff runs a toll on the attachment point or the rail. Again, its a lever arm working against you. For what benefit? A little less shadow?
    Well, with a suppressor, it can be quite a bit of shadow. With the can in place, it would also limit the amount of things that could get caught by the light, since it would have to fit between the suppressor and the light and then be able to lever it outward, while any impacts inward would be limited by the light/mount hitting the can.

  6. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Default.mp3 View Post
    Well, with a suppressor, it can be quite a bit of shadow. With the can in place, it would also limit the amount of things that could get caught by the light, since it would have to fit between the suppressor and the light and then be able to lever it outward, while any impacts inward would be limited by the light/mount hitting the can.
    2 of those 3 instances had cans on the gun.

    I have yet to be incumbered with PID using surefire and aac cans and surefire scouts

  7. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by KEW8338 View Post
    2 of those 3 instances had cans on the gun.

    I have yet to be incumbered with PID using surefire and aac cans and surefire scouts
    What kind of mounts were they using? I'm just asking out of curiosity. I'm personally not too worried and will continue to have my lights pushed past the handguard, as I don't patrol or anything, and my white light only guns have the lights at 1030 anyway, so any trip would be unlikely to see the light take the brunt of the impact as a right-hander.

  8. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by KEW8338 View Post
    Walking up a rock embankment, right hand shooter, rifle slung across the front, right foot forward, left foot back. Left foot gives way, right side of rifle shears down rock embankment. Light bar gets peeled back.

    Walking through the woods, do a target transition going from left to right, rifle light impacts a small tree and bends inboard toward the barrel.

    Walking through the woods, with rifle up and hunting, fall forward, rifle is kept oriented downrange. Extended light breaks fall into tree head long. Light bar bends outboard.

    I offset anything rail mounted, behind the front/muzzle end of the rail. So in whatever conditions, when gravity takes over, I try to let the front end of the rail be the bumper, vice the potentially life supporting gear (lazer, light etc)

    Surefires are built like a brick shithouse. I have not seen one break, from something unexpected. The forward mounted light stuff runs a toll on the attachment point or the rail. Again, its a lever arm working against you. For what benefit? A little less shadow?

    Thats the same reason, I use plastic vertical foregrips and not metal ones. The plastic breaks....
    Great info, thanks for taking the time to write it out.

    I wonder if you commented to those guys in advance, a warning and they rolled their eyes and then it happened. Or depending on the context, it might have been rude or socially unacceptable to do so.

    How about backup iron sights? I have been eyeballing the scalar fixed front site that is rail mounted. Now I’m back to my original idea, where the front site base is mounted directly to the barrel. Or, as you pointed out with the fore grip, maybe I run a plastic front site. Anything that would break the poly front site would likely damage the rail, right?

  9. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Default.mp3 View Post
    What kind of mounts were they using? I'm just asking out of curiosity. I'm personally not too worried and will continue to have my lights pushed past the handguard, as I don't patrol or anything, and my white light only guns have the lights at 1030 anyway, so any trip would be unlikely to see the light take the brunt of the impact as a right-hander.
    No idea on mount make

  10. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanch View Post
    Great info, thanks for taking the time to write it out.

    I wonder if you commented to those guys in advance, a warning and they rolled their eyes and then it happened. Or depending on the context, it might have been rude or socially unacceptable to do so.

    How about backup iron sights? I have been eyeballing the scalar fixed front site that is rail mounted. Now I’m back to my original idea, where the front site base is mounted directly to the barrel. Or, as you pointed out with the fore grip, maybe I run a plastic front site. Anything that would break the poly front site would likely damage the rail, right?
    I have offset 45, flip up irons on some guns. I don't have a hard on for back up irons.

    You can run a rifle however you want. Im not a gun nazi. Just saying what I have seen.

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