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Thread: Chauvin trial

  1. #161
    Site Supporter Totem Polar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe in PNG View Post
    Or another lawyer in Mnn with the same name as the defense attorney getting threats (scroll down).
    Christ. What is wrong with people.

    This.... this is why I am increasingly isolationist in my own lifestyle.
    ”But in the end all of these ideas just manufacture new criminals when the problem isn't a lack of criminals.” -JRB

  2. #162
    Member Gadfly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BehindBlueI's View Post
    I largely agree, and it's what I've said from the beginning. Holding him Floyd face down for so long was against current training and I can't think of a justification for it. It's both excessive force and failure to render aid. I don't think it's Murder, but it might be MN's Murder 3. We don't have a 'depraved heart' standard, so I'm not entirely sure how one proves it, but if a callous disregard for life qualifies I think you might sell a jury on holding someone down after they don't have a pulse as callous disregard.
    Agreed, before the cuffs are applied, you have some latitude on what a “reasonable officer” would do. But once the cuffs are applied, you own the suspect and their well being.

    I think if Chauvin was alone, we would have a different trial at play. Floyd was 6’4-6’6” tall depending on source, and a solid 224lbs per the medical examiner. Chauvin is 5’7-5’9” depending on the source, and 140lbs. Even cuffed and on the ground, he could probably buck and roll Cauvin off of him. But with 3 total officers on him? It gets real difficult to articulate the pin. I was waiting for either hearing an “overdose” cause of death, or possibly a MPD training manual that says to fully restrain a person who is high. Neither of those things came up at trail. So it’s not looking good for him...

    Positional asphyxia is a real thing. So is excited delirium. You could articulate the restraint for a couple of minutes, but once he has obviously stopped struggling and you have multiple back up officers, rolling him on his side is the safe play.

    Side note: One thing I actually hated at Fletc, but appreciate now, was being placed in full leg shackles and cuffs. We had to be walked all around the class building, up and down long flights of stairs, into and out of cars and transport vans. The point was for us to feel how hard it is to do simple things in those restraints. You can’t get mad at the suspect for not “hurrying up”. It’s difficult to do things while restrained. I have been cuffed and knelt on many hundreds of times as a trainer. I could always say “out of role” and have it stop if someone was going too rough. It gives you a better idea of how much force you can use, once you have been on the receiving end of it...

    I don’t thing Chauvin went out and committed intentional murder. But after a “meh” criminal defense, he better hope for manslaughter. My guess is we are just left wondering if it’s 5-10 for manslaughter or 20-40 for murder2.

    I am guessing the other 3 officer are going to fair much better. But Chauvin is most likely going away.
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  3. #163
    Abducted by Aliens Borderland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Totem Polar View Post
    Then there’s this, from CNN of all outlets:

    https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/19/polit...eal/index.html

    Maxine Waters really needs to stay home more, and talk less, as a general rule.
    I said from the beginning he wouldn't get a fair trial. I haven't really scrutinized what he did and have no opinion about a guilty verdict, but this is unbelievable.

    The defense attorney has it right. The jury should have been sequestered. How does a jury separate the media reports, BS coming from people like Waters and not have a biased opinion?

    It would be sweet justice if Chauvin walked because of her big mouth. They ought to arrest her for inciting a riot.
    In the P-F basket of deplorables.

  4. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by Borderland View Post
    I said from the beginning he wouldn't get a fair trial. I haven't really scrutinized what he did and have no opinion about a guilty verdict, but this is unbelievable.

    The defense attorney has it right. The jury should have been sequestered. How does a jury separate the media reports, BS coming from people like Waters and not have a biased opinion?

    It would be sweet justice if Chauvin walked because of her big mouth. They ought to arrest her for inciting a riot.
    Are you F#$king kidding me - the jury wasn’t sequestered? It correct, I didn’t know that. That’s just insane.

    Between that and Waters’ statements, I can definitely imagine grounds for appeal. (Not a lawyer, BTW).
    And still wondering why a bench trial wasn’t the smart play here...

  5. #165
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    Whatever Chauvin did he made himself famous. The standard of care applied while hard as hell to quantify, Resulted in the death of a Citizen,.

  6. #166
    banana republican blues's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GyroF-16 View Post
    Are you F#$king kidding me - the jury wasn’t sequestered? It correct, I didn’t know that. That’s just insane.

    Between that and Waters’ statements, I can definitely imagine grounds for appeal. (Not a lawyer, BTW).
    And still wondering why a bench trial wasn’t the smart play here...
    They were not sequestered during the trial. I believe the defense had requested just that...(I may be in error, but I believe I heard him make such a remark to the judge in the absence of the jurors once they were dismissed to deliberate.)
    There's nothing civil about this war.

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  7. #167
    Site Supporter Lon's Avatar
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    A defendant is entitled to a fair trial. I haven’t seen anything that leads me to believe this has been a fair trial. I can’t believe the judge has done some of the things he’s done.
    Formerly known as xpd54.
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  8. #168
    Four String Fumbler Joe in PNG's Avatar
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    Having recently re-read a couple of books* about the Civil Rights movement in 40's-60's Fl, and the nastiness the Jim Crow South showed to black people in general, I'm struck by the similarities I'm seeing. After all, it's basically a modern, woke version of cross burnings, night rides, and black mask instead of white hoods.


    *"Devil in the Grove" and "Beneath a Ruthless Sun"
    "You win 100% of the fights you avoid. If you're not there when it happens, you don't lose." - William Aprill
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  9. #169
    Judge Cahill did point out that Rep. Waters may have given the defense cause for appeal. He also said that she needs to STFU.

    It's sad that weak admonitions are about all that we can hope for in these dark days.


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  10. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe in PNG View Post
    Having recently re-read a couple of books* about the Civil Rights movement in 40's-60's Fl, and the nastiness the Jim Crow South showed to black people in general, I'm struck by the similarities I'm seeing. After all, it's basically a modern, woke version of cross burnings, night rides, and black mask instead of white hoods.
    I told my wife that this trial is in some ways a modern version of Tom Robinson's trial.

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