The Glock 48 is dumb: Change My Mind

[HCM]

So, if I bought a 43X or 48, put a 7sub and RDS on it, it won’t run very well? If Glock has said these guns won’t run with affixed accessories, why the heck would they introduce versions that are capable of affixing accessories? Something doesn’t add up.

Conversely, a P365/XL will not suffer degraded reliability from affixed accessories?

Remember, gun companies don’t exist to make guns, they exist to make money. If people want accessory rails on slimline guns and are willing to pay for them why wouldn’t Glock make them? People want all kinds of things that aren’t good for them, Irish whiskey, ice cream, Mexican strippers.....

Re- the P365XL- I don’t know if accessories on the rail will cause reliability problems. It’s a good question.

When we did our last round of duty gun testing half the guns were tested with a TLR1WML attached and the other half with no attachment. I don’t Know if that was Part of the slim line gun testing. We do have some smaller lights like the TLR7A on our authorized equipment list but there is nothing specifying what guns they can be used on.

The plastic of the P365 XL dust cover is stiffer than that of the Glock. Pure speculation here, but one of the things Glock did to address the GEN 3 WML issues in the service size guns was make the dust cover area stiffer.

[LittleLebowski]

Remember, gun companies don’t exist to make guns, they exist to make money. If people want accessory rails on slimline guns and are willing to pay for them why wouldn’t Glock make them? People want all kinds of things that aren’t good for them, Irish whiskey, ice cream, Mexican strippers.....

Re- the P365XL- I don’t know if accessories on the rail will cause reliability problems. It’s a good question.

When we did our last round of duty gun testing half the guns were tested with a TLR1WML attached and the other half with no attachment. I don’t Know if that was Part of the slim line gun testing. We do have some smaller lights like the TLR7A on our authorized equipment list but there is nothing specifying what guns they can be used on.

The plastic of the P365 XL dust cover is stiffer than that of the Glock. Pure speculation here, but one of the things Glock did to address the GEN 3 WML issues in the service size guns was make the dust cover area stiffer.

I’ll take my chances with Glock in Georgia over this. I don’t want to kindly do the needful after Sig’s long, long string of repeated recalls and parts upgrades across product lines. I know that Glock isn’t perfect either, but the odds seem to favor Glock. Now I’ll just go read about the giant clusterfuck of the Sig Cross rifle recall. Not to mention that ToddG was warning of Sig going cheap on internal parts a long, long, long time ago. Also the biggest fix for the Gen3 WML issues (for the .40s) was the RSA change in the Gen4s across the board for the .40s and 9mms, which of course caused issues with the Gen4 9mms because Glock didn’t bother to test with mainstream American range ammo, ask me how I know.

[LittleLebowski]

The G48 IS dumb because:

1) They shoehorned a short, dumb recoil spring into the 4" slide assembly and

2) made the dumb trigger guard too small for use in cold climates.


I hate dumb, cramped trigger guards. I think it spoils the 48, P365xl and perhaps even the 4" Shield Plus. Why? Just Why? Damn their dumb eyes!



Otherwise it's pure gold.

Username checks out.

[HCM]

I’ll take my chances with Glock in Georgia over this. I don’t want to kindly do the needful after Sig’s long, long string of repeated recalls and parts upgrades across product lines. I know that Glock isn’t perfect either, but the odds seem to favor Glock. Now I’ll just go read about the giant clusterfuck of the Sig Cross rifle recall. Not to mention that ToddG was warning of Sig going cheap on internal parts a long, long, long time ago. Also the biggest fix for the Gen3 WML issues (for the .40s) was the RSA change in the Gen4s across the board for the .40s and 9mms, which of course caused issues with the Gen4 9mms because Glock didn’t bother to test with mainstream American range ammo, ask me how I know.

And iPhones are made in China, so what? You get the level of QC you are willing to pay for. You think Glock doesn’t outsource parts to the 3rd world ? Remember the Gen 3 issues when Glock first went to the MIM LCI extractors ? Or Glock failing the DEA drop tests in the early 90s resulting in an “upgrade” program that should have been a recall ?

No matter how many guns Glock sells in the US, they are, and will see themselves as a European company that makes military and LE/GOV duty guns. Duty guns are calibrated to run on duty ammo, not WWB.

Even a broken clock is right twice a day. SIG getting the 365/365XL right, or at least as right as SIG gets now a days may well be an example of that but it doesn’t make it any less true. I’ve been pretty clear about my observations that full size Glocks > P320s but Glock is far from “perfection.” Like with 1911’s and 5” 45 acp guns, the more you deviate from service sized 9mms (G17.19.26,34) the more issues you will have.

Glock 40s have been flawed since their inception. The Gen4 RSA was an improvement but if it had solved Glocks .40 issues the wide slide Gen5s would not exist.

Frankly trusting any gun because brand x made it is foolish.



Maybe time to re-read this:

https://pistol-training.com/articles...rs-perspective

Trust No One: an insider’s perspective

by Todd Louis Green, pistol-training.com

Trying to decide which pistol to buy? If so, you’re probably looking for one that is guaranteed to be durable and reliable. Well, I’ve got bad news for you. There is no such gun. The day when you could point to a particular brand or model and be certain it would work 100% out of the box and last forever is gone.

After ten years in the firearms industry, including jobs at two major prestigious gun manufacturers, I have come to a very simple conclusion: no one makes a gun that you can be certain will work. Bias and personal preferences aside, most of the major manufacturers are more or less equal nowadays in quality. It wasn’t always that way, but as price became an increasingly important factor in buying decisions of both individuals and government entities, everything changed.

[Hot Cereal]

Glock 40s have been flawed since their inception. The Gen4 RSA was an improvement but if it had solved Glocks .40 issues the wide slide Gen5s would not exist.

I’ve been privileged to have lots of rounds on Glock FoTays and I do not share the opinion that all Glock 40s are inherently flawed.

I was issued a Gen3 22 with X200 and later X300U. We shot with the lights attached 100% of the time. We actually shot a lot (for an LE agency) with ~500 round two day trainings at least 2x a year common. During that time my 22 suffered a couple malfunctions, I don’t remember the exact number, but maybe two or three were possibly attributable to the WML. Another handful of malfunctions occurred when we had to source reload ammo and I had a case rupture that destroyed the extractor components. I as also issued a Gen2.5 27 and shortly after a Gen4 27 as a BUG which we shot about half as much as the 22s. Those guns were both flawless.

I comparison to my issued duty guns I carried a Gen3 23 that during that time I would drive hard as hell. Thousands of rounds through that gun wit and without WMLs and the only malfunctions I had were a handful of FTRB because I didn’t change an RSA when I should have.

The Gen3 40s are more prone to WML related malfunctions but I don’t think to a concerning level. Maybe compared to their 9mm counterparts they malfunctioned more often, but I can tell yo that we were a large agency 600+ with WML standard issue and we didn’t have any major issues and we didn’t jump at Gen4s to “fix” it. While they maybe more prone to malfunction, I think the issue is overblown. I’d carry a Glock FoTay without hesitation.

[LittleLebowski]

And iPhones are made in China, so what? You get the level of QC you are willing to pay for. You think Glock doesn’t outsource parts to the 3rd world ? Remember the Gen 3 issues when Glock first went to the MIM LCI extractors ? Or Glock failing the DEA drop tests in the early 90s resulting in an “upgrade” program that should have been a recall ?

No matter how many guns Glock sells in the US, they are, and will see themselves as a European company that makes military and LE/GOV duty guns. Duty guns are calibrated to run on duty ammo, not WWB.

Even a broken clock is right twice a day. SIG getting the 365/365XL right, or at least as right as SIG gets now a days may well be an example of that but it doesn’t make it any less true. I’ve been pretty clear about my observations that full size Glocks > P320s but Glock is far from “perfection.” Like with 1911’s and 5” 45 acp guns, the more you deviate from service sized 9mms (G17.19.26,34) the more issues you will have.

Glock 40s have been flawed since their inception. The Gen4 RSA was an improvement but if it had solved Glocks .40 issues the wide slide Gen5s would not exist.

Frankly trusting any gun because brand x made it is foolish.



Maybe time to re-read this:

https://pistol-training.com/articles...rs-perspective

Yup, we are going to disagree on Sig versus Glock.

[octagon]

The G48 IS dumb because:

1) They shoehorned a short, dumb recoil spring into the 4" slide assembly and

2) made the dumb trigger guard too small for use in cold climates.


I hate dumb, cramped trigger guards. I think it spoils the 48, P365xl and perhaps even the 4" Shield Plus. Why? Just Why? Damn their dumb eyes!



Otherwise it's pure gold.

Mossberg's MC2C is the better Glock 48 if it is reliable. It is the same basic size as the 48 except it is slightly shorter in height. It uses a full length RSA, has a larger trigger guard and flat faced trigger. Has all the same features as the 48. Front and rear cocking serrations, metal dovetail sights front and rear,slight beavertail, grip texture in the right places, railed from the start. Plus it uses factory 13 and 15 round magazines. The fact that the magazines actually fit flush at their base with the grip is an added nicety since the Glock mags stick out from the grip their entire length and width. Mossberg designed a slide back plate that allows for take down without pulling the trigger. I bet they, or someone else could design a slide back plate that incorporated a SCD feature and the take down into it if it was really wanted by enough buyers (and understood by enough to want it)

https://www.mossberg.com/product/mc2c-89012/

[CLaw]

I'll be honest... I'm a nobody with very little experience. But, I ran to the store to check out the Sig 365 XL that everyone seems to rave about... Dry fired it a few times... Nope, not for me. lol I wouldn't carry that gun. I'm just weird, but a Glock with a SCD is the only striker-fired gun I've come across which I'd carry appendix. And, not only did the 365 trigger seem too light and too short in travel, but I didn't think it felt that great in general (I guess I don't see what folks are getting at with it being "better" than a Glock trigger). Also tried the 365 with the safety. It seemed too small and too inadvertently easy to activate unintentionally on the offhand side.

[CLaw]

Double post on accident.

[HCM]

I’ve been privileged to have lots of rounds on Glock FoTays and I do not share the opinion that all Glock 40s are inherently flawed.

I was issued a Gen3 22 with X200 and later X300U. We shot with the lights attached 100% of the time. We actually shot a lot (for an LE agency) with ~500 round two day trainings at least 2x a year common. During that time my 22 suffered a couple malfunctions, I don’t remember the exact number, but maybe two or three were possibly attributable to the WML. Another handful of malfunctions occurred when we had to source reload ammo and I had a case rupture that destroyed the extractor components. I as also issued a Gen2.5 27 and shortly after a Gen4 27 as a BUG which we shot about half as much as the 22s. Those guns were both flawless.

I comparison to my issued duty guns I carried a Gen3 23 that during that time I would drive hard as hell. Thousands of rounds through that gun wit and without WMLs and the only malfunctions I had were a handful of FTRB because I didn’t change an RSA when I should have.

The Gen3 40s are more prone to WML related malfunctions but I don’t think to a concerning level. Maybe compared to their 9mm counterparts they malfunctioned more often, but I can tell yo that we were a large agency 600+ with WML standard issue and we didn’t have any major issues and we didn’t jump at Gen4s to “fix” it. While they maybe more prone to malfunction, I think the issue is overblown. I’d carry a Glock FoTay without hesitation.

The WML issue with gen3s is only part of the problem, the real issue being reduced reliability and durability vs the 9mm versions.

Some WMLs caused more issues than others and some ammo types caused more issues than others. A properly maintained Gen 3 G22 with no WML and 180 grain ammo is pretty reliable. Deviate from that with hotter /lighter bullet ammo, go to a G23 etc and your chance of problems increases exponentially. This is based on institutional users with 10k plus guns in service for a period of over 20 years.

Glock’s rush to put out a .40 cal back in the day resulted in them failing to re-engineer the Gun for .40 the way they should have I.e adding mass to the slide like everyone else. How early Glock knew this was a problem is debatable but at some point a Glock made a conscious decision to stick with a design that gave holster compatibility with the 9mm guns knowing it came at a cost. Glock made A LOT of money swapping LE restricted 40 guns/mags for pre ban 9mm guns/mags of all types.

I’m not a Glock hater, I have a decade carding a G17 & 26 as duty guns by choice vs SIG or HK 40s.