I have a 1-6 Razor and offset RDS (on Scalarworks mount).
The transition between magnified LPVO and RDS is quicker than caressing your handguard to adjust zoom.
I have a 1-6 Razor and offset RDS (on Scalarworks mount).
The transition between magnified LPVO and RDS is quicker than caressing your handguard to adjust zoom.
Yes. I currently have a T332 with 12 o’clock RDS that’s faster to shift than an offset and also doesn’t have weak shoulder and barricade limitations like an offset does.Originally Posted by RhinoJM
That’s not the point.
I’m experimenting with utilization of wanting to use the primary as a primary close up, but during the time of a transition with movement where the time is buried anyway, can I adjust without regripping.
Basically, I want to use the primary as a primary but have the option to switch it far without coming off the gun.
What RDS are ya running on top & any other relevant info?
I haven’t settled on anything yet and am still testing out ergos.
Right now using a 507c for the reticle to use for holdover. I might change to a 507 comp but I don’t get the sense it’s necessary in this capacity.
Hoping I can make a one optic solution work with the scope switch.
Understood all, asking as I still need to optify (I know) a backup 556 but could lateral a T2 there (magnify later?) and if so don’t want another Razer-E which had an AP offset but in your pic. are those 2 running LAW adapters on the stocks or …….
I haven’t settled on anything yet and am still testing out ergos.
Right now using a 507c for the reticle to use for holdover. I might change to a 507 comp but I don’t get the sense it’s necessary in this capacity.
Hoping I can make a one optic solution work with the scope switch.
They’re Sig MCXs which is why the folding 1913 rail attachments.
In no world is a piggyback RDS quicker than offset.
With piggyback, you have to break cheek weld, find red dot, and then engage target.
With offset (provided it's at the same height-over-bore height), you simply have to rotate your gun 30 degrees while maintaining cheek weld. It's instantaneous.
The benefit to piggyback RDS isn't the speed--rather, it's the ease of use w/ NVG.
There's a reason why all competition shooters use offsets, NOT piggyback.
Lastly, by stroking the handguard to adjust zoom, you are still "coming off the gun" in that your support hand would otherwise be used to, oh I don't know... support the rifle against a barrier?
You're not reaping any additional benefits over the simpler, lighter, and more reliable LPVO throw lever.
See, people often state opinion as fact.
So let's dive into this a little bit if you'll indulge me.
I love ergonomics and efficiency, it's kind of one of my strengths.
Your hypothesis #1:
Piggyback is slower than offset.
The extra considerations I have as a competition shooter are: what is the GUN doing in that time. I want the most stable gun and the simplest gun movement possible. That is a factor almost more important than anything else.
Here is a video with my setup.
With a piggyback, I'm just tilting my chin... gun doesn't move. Is it slower than an offset? I think I can tuck my chin faster than flare my elbow. Plus it doesn't move the gun.
What say you? Is piggyback slower?
Your hypothesis #2:
No benefit over LPVO throw lever.
Check this out:
I'm still not sold whether the T332 plus piggyback is a better option than an LPVO with slider... still testing and there are very specific situations where I would want this and you'd have to test under very specific conditions to exploit the benefits.
Half slide is... half the magnification so partial slide is 3x with the scope switch but I get the benefit of using my LPVO as a primary optic without offset or height over bore ergo issues. If I can basically have 3x on demand buried in the speed of a transition, that's huge for me.
One thing I’ll add about the scope switch is that you can still manually activate it on the bezel too.
So you don’t have to use the switch if you’re on a barricade or something.
Basically you get ANOTHER method of zooming. You can still keep the throw lever and use it manually.
Offset is not always same the HOB, and it's not instantaneous; BS. You're still moving the gun to get on the optic and that takes time. Fractions of seconds but still. For the rest, as someone who has put dicks in the dirt using a 12 o'clock mounted red dot on an ACOG I'll call bullshit. Prime example? I myself have several deployments as an Infantry guy, plenty of combat from room distance to just under or around 200 yards. My account not good enough? No problem, how about service wide? 20 years of GWOT with a 12 o'clock mount on ACOG, suffice? No, prior to that? Okay... CCO's or their predecessors mounted to carrying handles which also got plenty of work done. Yep you guessed it, chin weld. How do you explain all the 1.93" mounts being used just fine? Spare the snark dude. The truth is that everyone is different from their body composition and construction right down to flexibility, vision and personal preference. Maybe the 45 offset is faster for some, maybe not but there are also other considerations and none of this trash matters when put into contextual usage but I digress. In competition we're talking milliseconds and it's not that freaking hard to find a 12 o'clock mount on a chin weld, give me a break.
I'd also be willing to bet a PF dollar that there are plenty of dudes who do it because some other dude on the internet did so or said it was better without putting it to a timer for themselves. Marketing and the psyops involved are also a thing but whatever. Without snark, everything needs to be put on a timer because they don't lie and don't have agendas or biases, yeah I know broken record. You shouldn't be making the claim that it's better for everyone. Context matters so let me color within the lines for you some more. In addition to the above facts here are some additional reasons to not go for an offset. 1. The first one you touched on but I would be remiss if I didn't mention it. Yes, night vision. 2. Secondarily they are a snag hazard, especially if you're wrong handed and have gear or use a 3 point which I have personally seen, (stupid yes but still a thing). 3. Offsets also don't play well with switching to the other strong side, (yes I like my crap to be totally ambi). 4. If you're shooting suppressed. Guess what. If you're right handed you've just smoked out and obscured your vision. 5. Lastly offset does not provide the best recoil control, everything is a trade off. Personally, no thanks.
I'll go ahead and keep my 12 o'clock on my shitty ACOG and give 0 FK's what some random dude says on the web because I've used it and it works. I'll also encourage others to do the same and stick with the 12. As for the switch it's interesting but I am unsure about them. I definitely wouldn't try to use one in anything other than a competitive environment but they are interesting none the less but again. They need to be put on a timer vs. everything else.
Last edited by Mike C; 11-06-2023 at 09:30 PM.
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