What wore out?Originally Posted by DrkBlue
What wore out?
Mostly the frame was wearing out, I think, too much flex in recoil. There was some malfs so I replaced the spring assembly with a new from the factory around 9000 rounds.
Failures to feed became as common as one in five rounds with new spring assembly. Did not seem to have any relationship to the magazines nor ammo. It also was a bit sensitive on weak wristing in one hand drills, but I always cut some slack there because it a small gun being pushed to the design limits.
Per Kahr customer service I sent it in but it came back just as buggy as before from the factory. I also think the slide stop hole was beginning to hog out, but I didn’t measure the hole early enough to be able to offer conclusive evidence. The PM9 was above 9000 rounds, so I cannot complain too loudly.
Kahr’s customer service is not impressive and since this was my second troubled Kahr, I decided to cut my losses. My assessment is the polymer Kahrs are designed to be carried and rarely shot. I also doubt that packing a .380 into such a small frame will work well with the Kahr design.
Considering the Kahr PM9s recoil spring is supposed to be replaced every 1200-1500 rounds or so, it sounds like you caused the gun to fail prematurely through abuse/lack of preventative maintenance.
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@Alan0354
I had a Kahr P380 and still have a PM9. Given the P380's outstanding trigger, small size, excellent sights and good looks, it would be the best micro-compact 380 on the market if it would actually run. Several of us here have tried them and couldn't get them to run worth shit....I think the most number of rounds I could ever get mine to do without a malfunction was around 30. One guy here, @JodyH , even had 3 or so replacement guns from Kahr.
The PM9 is the smallest Kahr I would consider, and also the smallest 9mm on the market I would consider buying. Mine has been reliable. However, realize that Kahrs were among the first generation of micro 9mm guns, and gun companies have learned things since then.
They are hit or miss whether you get a good one. I was extremely lucky in that mine not only works great, but also works great with the extended 7-round mag. Many PM9s which work okay will still have trouble functioning with the extended mag.
The Kahr PM9 is the smallest 9mm you can get that is still reliable, but the slightly larger Glock 43 and SIG P365 are more sure bets if you are not beholden to the PM9's uniquely small size. I wanted it as a pocket and ankle gun, and it was the smallest gun on my agency's approved personally owned weapons list. If the SIG P365 or Glock 43 had existed at that time and were on the list, I would have bought one of those instead.
Last edited by TGS; 02-18-2021 at 08:21 AM.
"Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer
Cool, I appreciate your crusading for truth.
Did I state that I had not replaced the previous spring assemblies? I was heavily invested in the platform but I apologize for insufficiently documenting that to your satisfaction. FWIW, I also experienced the rumored issues with PM9s and freezing weather. There was also galling of plastic at the front of forward frame rails. I stand by the clearly labeled supposition the frame was reaching end of life at 10k.
Do you have a comparable round count PM9 experience that is different? If so, great. Please offer up.
I don’t recommend the platform and was transparent about the WHY. I had another Kahr that disassembled itself. Getting Kahr to address that failure was PITA too. I likewise LOVED the Kahr trigger and still have a K40 for a range only gun.
The way you wrote it made it sound like you only replaced the recoil spring at 9000 rounds.Cool, I appreciate your crusading for truth.
Did I state that I had not replaced the previous spring assemblies? I was heavily invested in the platform but I apologize for insufficiently documenting that to your satisfaction. FWIW, I also experienced the rumored issues with PM9s and freezing weather. There was also galling of plastic at the front of forward frame rails. I stand by the clearly labeled supposition the frame was reaching end of life at 10k.
Do you have a comparable round count PM9 experience that is different? If so, great. Please offer up.
I don’t recommend the platform and was transparent about the WHY. I had another Kahr that disassembled itself. Getting Kahr to address that failure was PITA too. I likewise LOVED the Kahr trigger and still have a K40 for a range only gun.
Chill dude.
"Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer
copied & pasted from an earlier kahr thread:
I don't buy the "you either get a good one or a lemon" - I bought a "known lemon" from a frustrated officer for cheap and fixed it with $50 in aftermarket followers. He had sent it back to Kahr, but at that time they hadn't updated their followers so they had no fix with oem parts (for a time, Kahr was even selling lakeline followers on their website).
Most of the 9mm Kahr feed issues can be resolved with new magazine followers. Kahr finally updated their own polymer followers a year or two back, or your can buy aluminum ones from Lakeline LLC out of Washington state. Before that, many people solved it by sanding and reshaping the follower (there is a write-up on kahrtalk), but those followers are still known to break so I prefer to replace them. Kahr magazine springs are often installed backwards which can cause feed issues too - check the owner's manual for the proper orientation.
Also check to see if the feed ramp is making contact with the follower. If so, you can dremel the part of the ramp making contact (search "kahr rampectomy" to find pictures on the internet) or just buy the Lakeline aluminum followers and shoot it enough until the aluminum gets bashed out of the way.
Finally be careful of the slide lock spring when reassembling. It is easy to bump out of place and you made need to use the torx to adjust & tighten it. Be careful not to overtorque.
Broken OEM Kahr follower:
"Rampectomy" :
Instead of doing a rampectomy, Lakeline aluminum followers will self-clearance during their break-in:
Correct magazine spring orientation:
https://images.app.goo.gl/yx3QGjFD2kXrSmr4A
I am seriously looking at Ruger LC380. Just play it safe, when the gun is too small and light, they have to compromise the design like stiffer recoil spring. But then it will be more sensitive to the power of the round, if the round is too weak, it will jam. Even the Ruger LC9 shows a lot more problem in feeding than the LC380. You just cannot have it all, power, weight and size do not co-exist that easy. I am sure if you spend the time to tweak a little at a time, you can make a small semi work, but to what end?
I’ve heard that the mid-sized Kahrs are more forgiving vs. the PMs and MKs. I can only say that my experience with a K9 has really left nothing to be desired in 1200 rounds (well, it can be a little rough on the hand after about ~150 rds.) I’ll also say that the K is still a very small gun (equivalent to the P in size) overall. It’s about the size of a Glock 43. Roughly the same weight as a PPK/S
The point being... maybe go for a K or a P. You might mitigate some of the quirks that come along with the super small ones. And I’d guess the steel frame on the K would prevent premature frame wearing. Though I couldn’t really complain in getting 10k out a P or a PM. The K9 was authorized for NYPD off-duty carry, at one time.
Owned aboot 11 trying to get one I trusted. If they ran they ran. Frame broke on a covert at 5 k. was replaced.... never trusted after that. No reason to deal with that shit show now with all the quality small semi's available.
If G42, G43, Shield, or LC9 were available never would have went down the Kahr road. One person's experience.
What state you live in? I can at least get S&W Shield in kalifornia.
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