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Thread: Canadian Special Forces pulls P320s from service after soldier injured by misfire

  1. #21
    Site Supporter HeavyDuty's Avatar
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    Not very bright but does lack ambition
    Another victim of Safariland being unable to get product out the door?

    /snark
    Ken

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  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by call_me_ski View Post
    So it sounds like Sig got the holster back with the gun to test. Yet they couldn’t replicate the problem despite having the combo, yet the implication is it was the holster despite them not being able to replicate it? It seems like the only basis to blaim the holster after testing is it is the most convenient thing to blaim. Were all the other problems related to the P320 due to being in modified P226 holsters? It sounds like Sig still has not idea what is going on with the P320.

    At some point, when is see smoke, I am going to assume there is fire. Regardless how hard Sig’s media department is working to tell me to not trust my lying little eyes. I just don’t see the reason to keep betting on the Sig when the market is so saturated with other options.
    Yeah I'm not exactly trusting Sig to be honest with any issues given how things have been poorly handled so far in regards to the P320. I would like it if the Canadians would share their findings once they're done investigating the incident but I'm sure they're going to decline to do so either due to secret squirrel stuff or NDAs. Shame that.
    “Conspiracy theories are just spoiler alerts these days.”

  3. #23
    Member GearFondler's Avatar
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    Sig P320:





    Glock:


  4. #24
    Gray Hobbyist Wondering Beard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GearFondler View Post
    Sig P320:





    Glock:


    HK:

    " La rose est sans pourquoi, elle fleurit parce qu’elle fleurit ; Elle n’a souci d’elle-même, ne demande pas si on la voit. » Angelus Silesius
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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by call_me_ski View Post
    So it sounds like Sig got the holster back with the gun to test. Yet they couldn’t replicate the problem despite having the combo, yet the implication is it was the holster despite them not being able to replicate it? It seems like the only basis to blaim the holster after testing is it is the most convenient thing to blaim. Were all the other problems related to the P320 due to being in modified P226 holsters? It sounds like Sig still has not idea what is going on with the P320.

    At some point, when is see smoke, I am going to assume there is fire. Regardless how hard Sig’s media department is working to tell me to not trust my lying little eyes. I just don’t see the reason to keep betting on the Sig when the market is so saturated with other options.
    Putting a gun with a short light trigger pull in a holster not made for that gun is user error.

    Here you have a holster that is A) made for a different gun and B) user modified.

    Compound that with the fact that you have an organization which has been using double action first shot pistols for decades switching to a striker fired pistol. As we have discussed before with the LA sheriffs office transition from the Beretta 92 to the Smith and Wesson M&P, and other orgs transitioning from DA to SF guns, there is normally an initial increase in NDs.

    Canada has been jerking around since 2011 in replacing pistols that should’ve been replaced 20 years ago. The problem is they want to have the guns made by colt Canada which is their only serious small arms production facility. While Canada has a large landmass they have a small population. A Canadian military pistol contract is not large enough to make licensing production I called Canada worthwhile for any of the major gunmakers makers.

  6. #26
    Site Supporter psalms144.1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirk View Post
    I haven't kept up with the Sig saga lately. So I'm guessing even the updated post-recall models *still* aren't drop safe? As much as I want to like the P320s, this continues to give me pause.
    Post upgrade pistols are allegedly drop safe, though the P320 owners manual does (did?) directly state that the pistol might discharge if dropped. Neither is "slam safe" - engagement surfaces holding the fully tensioned striker are very small, and tolerance stacking is a thing...

  7. #27
    Site Supporter psalms144.1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TicTacticalTimmy View Post
    The way they have been doing things has won them the contract to replace nearly all the pistols in US Military Service with the P320, as well as many other contracts not to mention explosive growth on the civilian side.
    Sig won the MHS contract exclusively on price per unit. Think about that for a minute - Sig underbid Glock while promising to produce a pistol with double the parts and an extremely more complicated assembly process. Sig is in the business of making money - they're banking on the press from the MHS to bring LE and civilian buyers into the fold. "Well, the Army tested this thing and selected it..."

  8. #28
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    LOL one can only hope.
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  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by HCM View Post
    Putting a gun with a short light trigger pull in a holster not made for that gun is user error.

    Here you have a holster that is A) made for a different gun and B) user modified.

    Compound that with the fact that you have an organization which has been using double action first shot pistols for decades switching to a striker fired pistol. As we have discussed before with the LA sheriffs office transition from the Beretta 92 to the Smith and Wesson M&P, and other orgs transitioning from DA to SF guns, there is normally an initial increase in NDs.

    Canada has been jerking around since 2011 in replacing pistols that should’ve been replaced 20 years ago. The problem is they want to have the guns made by colt Canada which is their only serious small arms production facility. While Canada has a large landmass they have a small population. A Canadian military pistol contract is not large enough to make licensing production I called Canada worthwhile for any of the major gunmakers makers.
    I agree that using the wrong holster is user error. However that doesn’t automatically mean it is the user error that caused the problem. It should be a fairly easy failure mode to test. Either the holster can be made to contact the trigger when in the holster or it can’t. I imagine Sig tried their best to have the holster cause the problem. The multitude of small parts inside the gun have many more variables in testing. This combined with the numerous other reports of problems and history of Sig openly lying to customers about the issue(beyond the typical no comment companies give) has kind of lost them the benefit of the doubt in my mind.

    I wonder if the guns were pulled from service immediately and it was just reported of if they were pulled a few months later, after an investigation. If the unit waited to pull the guns after an investigation it may be more telling than any statement from Sig.

  10. #30

    Copy Glock

    Quote Originally Posted by Polecat View Post
    Sig should try their hand at a more simplified design: think a Sig Glock if that makes sense.
    Copy Glock, pay a few million for whatever infringement of that design, then soldier on.

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