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Thread: Firearms training simulators

  1. #11
    Site Supporter Lon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobM View Post
    We're probably not looking to buy our own system unless they're less expensive than I'm thinking. There used to vendors who'd show up with a FATS machine, and either run it or teach a couple guys to run it, and they'd leave in a day or two. I'd imagine they vendors I used are long retired as we quit using them when the state began providing the same service for free. The only makers I know of so far are InVernis, which as far as I can tell used to be FATS, and something called VirTra.
    Beavercreek has a nice one. Let me find out which one.
    Formerly known as xpd54.
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  2. #12
    Site Supporter Lon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobM View Post
    Years ago, we would annually rent a FATS machine. A few years ago, the Ohio Peace Officer's Academy began providing a simulator and operator at no charge on request, but they stopped doing that this year. Does anyone have any thoughts on what's currently available, or vendors that would bring one for a few days a year?
    Beavercreek uses MILO.

    https://www.faac.com/milo-range/

    Wonder if you could find about their agency or 2 to go in and spilt the cost with you to buy one?
    Formerly known as xpd54.
    The opinions expressed in this post are my own and do not reflect the opinions or policies of my employer.
    www.gunsnobbery.wordpress.com

  3. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Lon View Post
    Beavercreek uses MILO.

    https://www.faac.com/milo-range/

    Wonder if you could find about their agency or 2 to go in and spilt the cost with you to buy one?
    Thanks, I'm pretty sure that's the one OPOTA used but I couldn't remember the name.

  4. #14
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    Back when homeland defense was giving money away somebody decided our county needed the Prism system. Each department in the county sent officers to be trainers. It was a laptop and a projector system that came with laser guns and hundreds of scenarios. The scenarios had branching choices that allowed me to reward tactically good choices and punish mistakes. The laser guns went through a lot of watch batteries. I liked the system. If you get one; get the wireless version. Our version had the cables and was a pain in the ass to set up. The cables had to be taped to the floor. It was easy to have an officer go through dozens of scenarios in an hour. We would pull guys off the road for an hour. If you are an instructor you have to go through hundreds of scenarios and pick the ones you think have the most value. It is easy to treat it as a shoot’em up video game. I tried to make 80 percent of the scenarios no shoot. The nice part is you can run the same scenario with multiple outcomes. Suspect flees, pulls gun, surrenders etc

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by BobM View Post
    Years ago, we would annually rent a FATS machine. A few years ago, the Ohio Peace Officer's Academy began providing a simulator and operator at no charge on request, but they stopped doing that this year. Does anyone have any thoughts on what's currently available, or vendors that would bring one for a few days a year?
    If you find one, let me know and I’ll share the cost if not too crazy.

  6. #16
    Site Supporter Lon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gtmtnbiker98 View Post
    If you find one, let me know and I’ll share the cost if not too crazy.
    I can ask the brass. Maybe we can split 3 ways?
    Formerly known as xpd54.
    The opinions expressed in this post are my own and do not reflect the opinions or policies of my employer.
    www.gunsnobbery.wordpress.com

  7. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Lon View Post
    I can ask the brass. Maybe we can split 3 ways?
    I'm interested so long as it isn't too crazy.

  8. #18
    When I became Rangemaster at our department we had just purchased the CAPS system. I had to get trained on set up and use then run our regular and reserve officers through it. 300 people later I can say it is OK in most areas for a live fire,scenario based system in heavy use.

    It consists of a large screen(6' tall 8' wide) of paper on wood frame where scenarios are projected. The projector,computer,speaker,controller is self contained DVD based alternate branching scenarios with hearing protection/audio input headphones for each participant and the controller. It is reliable and easy to set up and run. It can be fixed easily enough with common off the shelf electronics if it goes down and allows for live fire scenario training. I think we had around a dozen DVDs each with quite a few scenarios with various shoot/don't shoot outcomes. In total we had over 100 different scenarios available.

    Downsides are that it is a flat screen and all fire is one way downrange so the student/participant always knows where the threat is. It also has some downtime between scenarios for pasting shots. This can be minimized by having a student not participating or who has just finished do the pasting while instructor and student debrief.

    Of the systems I have used,researched or am familiar with I would rank them as such.

    Laser based Force on Force (Stress vest Setcan)
    Simunitions/UTG/Airsoft
    VIRTRA 300 or 180
    CAPS for live fire = FATS for non live fire

    I would add that we got an Oculus II for the holidays and using it with Gun Range VR I can see that being a real alternative to other non live fire simulation trainers in the near future for A LOT less expense and easier use than what's available today.

  9. #19
    Member snow white's Avatar
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    Oct 2016
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    Lakes region, New Hampshire
    Quote Originally Posted by octagon View Post
    When I became Rangemaster at our department we had just purchased the CAPS system. I had to get trained on set up and use then run our regular and reserve officers through it. 300 people later I can say it is OK in most areas for a live fire,scenario based system in heavy use.
    It consists of a large screen(6' tall 8' wide) of paper on wood frame where scenarios are projected. The projector,computer,speaker,controller is self contained DVD based alternate branching scenarios with hearing protection/audio input headphones for each participant and the controller. It is reliable and easy to set up and run. It can be fixed easily enough with common off the shelf electronics if it goes down and allows for live fire scenario training. I think we had around a dozen DVDs each with quite a few scenarios with various shoot/don't shoot outcomes. In total we had over 100 different scenarios available.

    Downsides are that it is a flat screen and all fire is one way downrange so the student/participant always knows where the threat is. It also has some downtime between scenarios for pasting shots. This can be minimized by having a student not participating or who has just finished do the pasting while instructor and student debrief.

    Of the systems I have used,researched or am familiar with I would rank them as such.

    Laser based Force on Force (Stress vest Setcan)
    Simunitions/UTG/Airsoft
    VIRTRA 300 or 180
    CAPS for live fire = FATS for non live fire

    I would add that we got an Oculus II for the holidays and using it with Gun Range VR I can see that being a real alternative to other non live fire simulation trainers in the near future for A LOT less expense and easier use than what's available today.
    Have you tried onward yet? My father in law got the oculus II for Xmas and I was going hard on that game for a while. I can see that being useful for stuff other than the actual shooting stuff as its pretty funky with the controllers. But I definitely see some potential. I bet there are firearm simulation controllers you can get to make it feel a bit more realistic on the physical shooting side of things.
    Come, mother, come! For terror is thy name, death is in thy breath, and every shaking step destroys a world for e'er. Thou 'time', the all-destroyer! Come, O mother, come!

  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Poconnor View Post
    Back when homeland defense was giving money away somebody decided our county needed the Prism system. Each department in the county sent officers to be trainers. It was a laptop and a projector system that came with laser guns and hundreds of scenarios. The scenarios had branching choices that allowed me to reward tactically good choices and punish mistakes. The laser guns went through a lot of watch batteries. I liked the system. If you get one; get the wireless version. Our version had the cables and was a pain in the ass to set up. The cables had to be taped to the floor. It was easy to have an officer go through dozens of scenarios in an hour. We would pull guys off the road for an hour. If you are an instructor you have to go through hundreds of scenarios and pick the ones you think have the most value. It is easy to treat it as a shoot’em up video game. I tried to make 80 percent of the scenarios no shoot. The nice part is you can run the same scenario with multiple outcomes. Suspect flees, pulls gun, surrenders etc
    I wonder how close Shootoff, is to that now?

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