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Thread: Stacking wound cavities?

  1. #11
    Site Supporter JohnO's Avatar
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  2. #12
    Member John Hearne's Avatar
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    Classic example of the ignorance caused by not understanding that we live in a three dimensional world. The odds that two bullets would fire the same track in the real world, where people respond to large noises, is absurd. Even if the bullet went in the same hole, it would very likely follow a different track through the body. And if I'm lucky enough for my first round to go where I wanted it - high chest taking the great vessels above the heart - I'd be more than happy to send a second one along that path.
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  3. #13
    I would suggest it's a case of being "Just incompetent enough". A very tiny part of the idea isn't dumb--the idea that one doesn't need to wait for the pistol to go completely still before firing another shot. He may have read that someplace. Everything afterwards is either a result of not being trained himself, not reading enough, or just trying to sell more classes. I know lots of guys that sell classes by saying/doing stupid things that sound cool, it's a legit path to success.

  4. #14
    Murder Machine, Harmless Fuzzball TCinVA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HCountyGuy View Post
    I have a coworker who recently had a session with a firearms instructor. One of the items in the lesson was “double-taps” and the way it was conveyed was firing a shot, then following up with the next shot during the recoil cycle causing the next round to go just a bit higher than the first but close enough to combine the two wound cavities for more damage.
    That person doesn't understand how semi-automatic pistols work.
    3/15/2016

  5. #15
    Well, I guess the cat is out of the bag. Yep, this is a step 2 out of three for an advanced engagement sequencing.

    First step is to tense up your strong wrist (some uninitiated call is flinching) and stack a second shot under the first. Step two is one described above, trigger a shot before your sights settle and stack a follow-up shot above the first one. Step three, and it is a true mastery, three shot sequence combining step one and two, stacking three holes to a devastating effect. Only exploding heart technique comes close



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  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by TCinVA View Post
    That person doesn't understand how semi-automatic pistols work.
    The instructor is retired LE, lead the SWAT team where he worked and supposedly even had a hand in training some local federal guys...

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    “Conspiracy theories are just spoiler alerts these days.”

  7. #17
    Sounds to me like a poor explanation of Jeff Cooper and the Double Tap.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_tap

  8. #18
    Its obvious to me you guys are piling on the instructor unfairly when the truth is OP's friend is just a bad listener. He obviously forgot the instructors full explanation which went something like this:

    "Ok guys, here is how we perform the famous double tap. First, you present your pistol to the threat and fire a round in his general direction. This will cause the threat to get very scared, drop his own weapon, and put his hands over his eyes for up to 10 seconds. During this interval you SPRINT back to your patrol car, pop the trunk, and grab the AN-94 you have kept in there. Make sure the AN-94 is in its 2 round hurst mode, and fire a burst into the target who by now will have uncovered his eyes, grabbed his weapon, and resumed threatening behavior. This is what is called a 'double tap' and should cause two rounds to impact almost on top of eachother, combining their wound channels for maximum damage. The yawing tendency of the 5.45mm 7N6 cartridge further increases the likelihood of overlapping wound channels."

  9. #19
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    I never expected handguns to have a wound cavity. I just hoped a handgun would punch holes in the assailant to let the blood leak out. I think many too police officers do not understand terminal ballistics and put too much stock in range tests and marketing. I taught the three “B”’s of stopping power explained as
    Brain shot,
    Blood loss, and
    Balls- ie they ran or surrendered.
    When I became a police officer back in the nineties I stopped training for the double tap. I wanted to be accountable and aware of each shot. Are they trying to kill me? Must I shoot them right now? Fire gun; repeat as necessary. I wish DB would wade in and explain it better than me. My department issued 1911s in 45. I used to joke that if a bad guy tried to kill me I would center punch them, reassess and fire again as needed; and hopefully they would fall over while I was speed reloading. Looking back 20 years ago many of my jokes were really stupid. A favorite range drill was to tell the line draw and shoot 2, repeat. Draw and fire 3. Draw and fire 4. We ran a hot range. After the initial make ready I did not tell them when to reload or top off mags. The above drill was tailored for 1911s with 8 shot mags and forced them to make a speed reload if they did not tactical reload.

  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by BN View Post
    Sounds to me like a poor explanation of Jeff Cooper and the Double Tap...
    Quote Originally Posted by TicTacticalTimmy View Post
    Its obvious to me you guys are piling on the instructor unfairly when the truth is OP's friend is just a bad listener. He obviously forgot the instructors full explanation...
    I can recall trainer John Farnam encouraging us (as a class, and as individual members of the class) to shoot faster than we had been. We were using - if I recall correctly - USPSA targets, and his point was that a fast series of shots into the A-zone, provided it was in a (more-or-less) vertical line, was better than a (too) slow one-hole group, and that a further benefit of the (faster) vertically-placed series in the A-zone is that it would produce multiple wound tracks. It's not difficult for me to imagine that someone else might hear that, second-hand and out of context, and Monday-morning QB it to paraphrase that we'd been encouraged to shoot inaccurately.

    To me, it's obvious that the student (in the original post) misunderstood the instructor's teaching point.

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