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Thread: HELLCAT returned: Warranty issue still unclear. to me

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Navin Johnson View Post
    Friendly advice.....

    Yours is probably the only hellcat thread on this entire form.....

    Cut your losses on testing with hard to get ammo and buy a reputable firearm.....

    you'll spend more money on testing and sending it back and forth than you will on trading it in or selling it and buying something else.....
    Above is the best advice.

    Questions to ask yourself:

    1. How much do I have to spend for 9mm ammo now?

    2. Where can I find 9mm ammo now?

    3. How much 9mm ammo do I need to fire through the Hellcat to feel comfortable with it? 100 rounds? 200 rounds?

    4. where am I going to find the ammo to replace the ammo expended and how much is it going to cost me?

  2. #22
    Site Supporter Hambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeep45238 View Post
    Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if the chamber is out of spec due to worn tooling and could use a finish reamer.
    Off topic, but software in CNC machines account for tool wear.
    "Gunfighting is a thinking man's game. So we might want to bring thinking back into it."-MDFA

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  3. #23
    Chasing the Horizon RJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clusterfrack View Post
    Translation: we have no idea what's wrong, but hopefully this will make the customer happy. Our customers typically don't shoot guns very often, and like bright shiny things, so a polished chamber should do the trick.
    I rather suspect this is the correct interpretation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hambo View Post
    Then it's time to move the Hellcat down the road while he can get top dollar.
    +1.

    I can't add much to the excellent advice you are getting, @Chomps, but I will say this: I am still relatively new to guns, compared to most of the guys here. I've recently (last five years) gone through multiple handguns and had a couple or three at the same time quite often. In fact I'd say that having multiple guns for folks like me (just learning) actually slows down progress in shooting proficiency, as you mentally adjust to different trigger systems, ergonomics, control specifications, etc. that make them all different.

    Which, if I need a gun in a life or death situation, is not a great place to be. I now believe the use of a gun in extremis should be unconsciously competent. Meaning you shouldn't really have to "think" about it; the use should be automatic, so you can focus more on assessing and dealing with the threat. (I stress I am no high speed low drag trainer; just some random dude on the internet trying to avoid being on YouTube.)

    So, keeping two guns is ok, as long as one is essentially the same as the other if not exactly the same (i.e. same trigger system, same controls, same press, etc.) One of the best pieces of advice I read from one of the SMEs here ( @DocGKR ) was to "buy two Glock 19s and a case of ammo". I did not realize at the time how much faster my shooting would have progressed if I'd simply done that.

    My 0.02 anyway. Good luck!

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by jeep45238 View Post
    Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if the chamber is out of spec due to worn tooling and could use a finish reamer.

    As a comparison, this is from my Dan Wesson that had extraction issues in the first few hundred rounds (they did extra work to make up for the issue happening to begin with, and at my request a standard profile slide stop). The smith working on it called me and explained the why leading up to these modifications.

    -------------------

    Good morning,

    Work on Valor commander xxxx has been completed as follows:

    1. New low-profile slide stop installed (50.00)
    2. Chamber was reamed and honed
    3. Feed ramp was deburred/polished
    4. Extractor was replaced
    5. #2 barrel link was installed
    6. Thumb safety was dehorned and re-finished
    7. Magazine catch was clearance cut
    8. Fire-control polished
    9. Grip safety deburred
    10. Trigger tuned to 1 ¾# X 3 ½#
    11. Trigger over-travel screw adjusted


    Functions checks and Test fire was done using S&B 115g. and Magtech 115g. “ball”
    No malfunctions were experienced during 100 round live fire.

    Total comes to 50.00 even for the slide stop
    Honestly this is more concerning than the Hellcat story. If all of that work had to be done, how did it get out the door the first time?

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hambo View Post
    Off topic, but software in CNC machines account for tool wear.


    Assuming the rolling isn’t worn beyond the spec of the programming. I’ve had a SA pistol that would only function with 115 SB until a finish reamer was applied, and with the numbers being pushed in production I wouldn’t be shocked if tooling is pushed further past proper machining capability.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by HTM View Post
    Honestly this is more concerning than the Hellcat story. If all of that work had to be done, how did it get out the door the first time?


    Outside of the extractor and link, the smith went through the gun and did everything they had on a custom shop list of things to compensate for the fact it happened in the first place.

  7. #27
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    My guess is that polishing the chamber included slightly reshaping the feed ramp and beveling the area at the mouth of the chamber. Next removing the extractor and cleaning gunk from the area where the extractor fits into the frame might have resolved the issue. I suspect that the extractor was not allowing the rim to enter the extractor groove. The tech may have filed .002 off the inside of the extractor behind the claw to allow it to grab the rim more positively. The tech may have adjusted the mag lips by very slightly tapping them inward. In this scenario the tech spent 20 minutes making small adjustments. How do I think I know all this? I played with Kel-Tec pistols in 380 and 9mm. All were screwed up. I fixed each by such tinkering. Though ham fisted and clumsy, I will brag that I never fucked up a Kel-Tec. They were like that to start with. The op may have a good sock drawer pistol. When I asked the young girl at Harbor Freight if their tools are any good, she said they is if you don't use them. Some gun brands are like that.

  8. #28
    Site Supporter HeavyDuty's Avatar
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    I can accept some crankiness in a purely range toy, but not in defensive weapon.
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  9. #29
    Member Chomps's Avatar
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    Just to show what it was like & how it was returned,.. For those of you that can make sense of these images. 😉😂. They don't tell "Me" too much, but then Im pretty firearm illiterate atm. Lol
    (Apologize for the first image. Focus was pretty soft.)

    You can see in the first image that the,.. I guess it's the Feed Ramp? Does look a little rough. Even looks like some slight perpendicular striations across the direction of the feed. (...and yes! Those are flecks of brass, I assume scraped off the FMJ rounds in the chamber.)

    Second image is a lot smoother looking and has much more polished, smoothed metal surfaces around the chamber than the first image. Not sure what those mark/lines are on the ramp & chamber. Thought it was lube,.. but doesn't wipe off. I'll assume they're some sort of marks from the "Over 50 Rounds" they used to test the gun before returning it.

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  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chomps View Post
    Just to show what it was like & how it was returned,.. For those of you that can make sense of these images. 😉😂. They don't tell "Me" too much, but then Im pretty firearm illiterate atm. Lol
    (Apologize for the first image. Focus was pretty soft.)

    You can see in the first image that the,.. I guess it's the Feed Ramp? Does look a little rough. Even looks like some slight perpendicular striations across the direction of the feed. (...and yes! Those are flecks of brass, I assume scraped off the FMJ rounds in the chamber.)

    Second image is a lot smoother looking and has much more polished, smoothed metal surfaces around the chamber than the first image. Not sure what those mark/lines are on the ramp & chamber. Thought it was lube,.. but doesn't wipe off. I'll assume they're some sort of marks from the "Over 50 Rounds" they used to test the gun before returning it.

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    I personally have never seen any marks like that, maybe someone else here has. Have you fired the gun since it was "repaired"?

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