LTT 92 or Shadow 2

[Sal Picante]

Outside of the 92X Performance, do you consider all the rest of the Beretta M9/92 models basically equals?

Largely, yes. They're all the same "basic idea" of pistol. The small nuances do stack up and that's where the price becomes questionable... E.g. Anyone who buys a basic beater 92FS "trade-in" is going to spend $$ on the trigger kit, the rear sight, grips, extended magazine release and MecGar mags to make it competitive.

The alternative is to buy a new LTT and be pretty much there.

The 92XPerformance only seems different. Safeties, steel frame, etc. The reality is, tho, that it too feels much like an old Brig-slide Beretta Elite, E2, or G-SD. Once i shot it for a bit I forgot I was shooting the steel-framed "race gun"... It is still a falling-block Beretta 92...

[Sal Picante]

I’m wanting to join the da/sa crowd. I’ve traditionally been a Glock guy and recently started shooting sig strikers. I want a full size da/sa with the main intended use of Uspsa production.

Help me see the pros and cons of both.

If LTT which one? Full size?

While this thread devolves into the intangible nuances of aficionado-oriented DA/SA pistols, I kept thinking about your motivations while I cracked a beer...

Re-read your question...

Why not shoot USPSA with what you got for a bit?

I mean, don't let any of us stop you if you want to toss a cool grand at a range toy, but, seriously, you can go so far with a Sig320 or a Glock17.
I mean, Nils Jonasson has been winning all the area matches with a tuned Glock and Mason Lane has been right there with a tricked out P320.
The difference is really finding something that you like - and understanding the preference really comes from getting out there and engaging in the sport.

[Bucky]

Could you elaborate on what advantages the S2 has over the LTT for you @Bucky?

1. The weight
2. The linear like pull of the trigger.
3. The short trigger return (and reset if that’s your thing)
4. The grip, once I got used to it. It really points well to the point I feel I’m more likely to get the lucky hit when I lose the sites than any other platform.
5. The gun is super accurate, both mechanically and practically.

[Bucky]

Why did you bail on IDPA when they changed the penalty?

While I really like the concept of the sport, I think it’s an utter fail at meeting their attempted goal. That being said, it was still a good time to hang out with other gun people and put rounds down range. Now given a choice, I’d always pick a USPSA match over an IDPA match. Aside from the obvious rule differences, a typical USPSA match will have three to four times the round count, and I’ll usually be done much quicker... at least in my area. Still, there were days where the IDPA match was more practical (much closer).

When it was 1/2 second down per point, the emphasis was already weighing accuracy WAY above speed. Let’s just say friends of mine, who are winning not just locally, call it a walking bullseye match. I find it to be an accurate assessment.

In fairness, it should be noted that I no longer feel the need to shoot every single Saturday and Sunday, so the low round count slower paced match was obviously the first to be dropped I still keep my membership current though.

[Bucky]

Outside of the 92X Performance, do you consider all the rest of the Beretta M9/92 models basically equals?

I know you’re not addressing me, but I’ll add my 2¢ and say NO! I find the enhanced models, such as the Elite 2 to have many advantages over a base 92. Aside from stuff that’s easily swapped out (trigger job, mag button, etc) you have:

1. Beveled mag well
2. Front strap and back strap checkering
3. Replaceable front sight
4. Front cocking serrations.

[MGW]

Largely, yes. They're all the same "basic idea" of pistol. The small nuances do stack up and that's where the price becomes questionable... E.g. Anyone who buys a basic beater 92FS "trade-in" is going to spend $$ on the trigger kit, the rear sight, grips, extended magazine release and MecGar mags to make it competitive.

The alternative is to buy a new LTT and be pretty much there.

The 92XPerformance only seems different. Safeties, steel frame, etc. The reality is, tho, that it too feels much like an old Brig-slide Beretta Elite, E2, or G-SD. Once i shot it for a bit I forgot I was shooting the steel-framed "race gun"... It is still a falling-block Beretta 92...

You’re shooting a 92x Performance now? Are you using the Vertec frame as is of the wrap around grips? What are your thoughts about the pistol in general?

[Wheeler]

While I really like the concept of the sport, I think it’s an utter fail at meeting their attempted goal. That being said, it was still a good time to hang out with other gun people and put rounds down range. Now given a choice, I’d always pick a USPSA match over an IDPA match. Aside from the obvious rule differences, a typical USPSA match will have three to four times the round count, and I’ll usually be done much quicker... at least in my area. Still, there were days where the IDPA match was more practical (much closer).

When it was 1/2 second down per point, the emphasis was already weighing accuracy WAY above speed. Let’s just say friends of mine, who are winning not just locally, call it a walking bullseye match. I find it to be an accurate assessment.

In fairness, it should be noted that I no longer feel the need to shoot every single Saturday and Sunday, so the low round count slower paced match was obviously the first to be dropped I still keep my membership current though.

That’s interesting. Thanks for clarifying for me.

[Clusterfrack]

I own both. Not exactly, my LTT is not a "production" LTT but a full custom work on my own 92G-isn variant. I would give a slight nod to Shadow for better trigger, better sights (big one for me, I like narrow adjustable and there isn't a good such option for Berettas, or I don't know of one), and these days easier transition to carry optic option with Shadow 2. Doing an unloaded start on a hot Beretta barrel is either slower, or not much fun. Taking apart Beretta is not anything I want to do again, specifically talking about slide. Taking apart CZ is nothing big as long as you don't mess with a sear cage. I also found CZs be slightly more accurate. I use factory ammo and shot 115, 124, 147 and 150 gr ammo out of CZ without any problems.
I do prefer Beretta's grip and how it cycles. CZ breaks parts regularly, not seen that with a Beretta.
My overall preference is a Shadow 2, Beretta is living in my safe.

What parts, and at what round counts? My 3 S2s have not had anything unusual happen. My practice gun went over 30k on one slide stop (commonly replaced at ~10k on a S2), and now has 20k on the second SS. The CGW trigger return springs have been extremely durable. My estimate is >100k cycles on the practice gun before the TRS broke.

Nothing else has needed replacement, other than recoil springs.

I do use a thin film of grease on the slide stop, and that seems to improve service life of this part.

And, your point about disassembly is a very good one. Any competition gun I own needs to be able to be detail stripped easily, and serviced by me, without needing a gunsmith. The S2 is super easy to work on. Not quite a simple as a Glock, but not that much more difficult either.

[YVK]

What parts, and at what round counts?

Slide stops every 10k. Front sights, something weird happened this summer. They got loose in their pockets on both guns, and one flew off despite pin staying in place. The second I can wiggle up and down with my fingers. One oem, another Dawson. My summer practice volume and content may have been too stressful on them though

[Clusterfrack]

Slide stops every 10k. Front sights, something weird happened this summer. They got loose in their pockets on both guns, and one flew off despite pin staying in place. The second I can wiggle up and down with my fingers. One oem, another Dawson. My summer practice volume and content may have been too stressful on them though

That’s weird about the sights. Did you add an aftermarket bushing? My guns have pretty high round counts and no issues.