Originally Posted by jeep45238
That is super helpful thanks.
That is super helpful thanks.
Hold forehead depending on proximity. I can't for the life of me think of any time I ever needed to shoot a 1" circle for real. But military experience is greatly different, line vs DM vs Sniper role was different as is LE patrol work vs sniper vs Civvy life. In my personal experience the highest probability shot in controlled pairs or hammered was priority, (depending on proximity) in high thoracic then it was a transition to head box if there was a failure to incapacitate.
Personally I think that you are over thinking this. Train accordingly and focus on the skills that are in context with your highest probability problem but do not ignore the other 20% entirely. I would never pick a pistol over a rifle unless I am in a very confined space period, end of story. As far as windage is concerned I wouldn't be flipping out about it within 25 yards and certainly not 10. There is still plenty of room for error in the ocular cavity for that range if that is your intended targeted area but, still keep it within reason. I know its' a bit tongue & cheek. Try to keep things in perspective. A rifle or carbine is almost always better than a pistol but there is no reason to hash that out.
Last edited by Mike C; 10-08-2020 at 09:42 PM.
Shift to your iron sights for CQB. Instead of using your front sight post, aim using the "shelf" on the front sight base between the dog ears. Center the shelf vertically in your rear aperture just like you do with the tip of the front sight post.
Although it won't help the moment you get into a bind, I have a small dope chart taped to the stocks of my duty rifles. It helps if you ever forget.
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Thank you for the reality check. I truly don’t know what I don’t know with a long gun.
Good stuff here.
I’m appreciating the vicarious experience.
Lots of good advice.
Our quals have lots of failure drills at 10 yards and in. Failure to offset will cause you to toss enough head shots to fail your qual. While I believe in giving shooters every opportunity to succeed, I disagree with reminding shooters about offset during the qual. But what does my opinion count, since I am no longer an instructor?
That is a practical reason for some to learn offset. One teaching tool I have used in nearly every carbine class I have taught is:
I kept it my pocket on the line to show shooters very clearly mechanical offset. Tough on a tightly controlled range, but at 1 yard you can physically put your muzzle on the target and look through your sights to see roughly where you need to actually aim.
I like Shawn's iron sight technique, and I think I recall Paul Howe many moons ago using a dead on hold with the front sight but stacking it on top of the rear sight, instead of looking at it through the rear aperture. Another instructor (Gonzales?) advocated burying the base of the front sight into the base of the aperture while zeroing. All of which will lower the POI as they push the muzzle down in reference to the target. Only practice with your setup will determine if one works and provides enough offset for you on your setup. None of them work particularly well with a plain dot, hence the recommendation to switch to irons.
That said, looking at the occular target zone (the "scuba mask" in our state mandated qual targets) and commonly represented here on P-F as a 3x5 index card, a three inch target is an adequite goal. In some courses we used a business card for a tighter target. And as Uncle Pat used to say, if you make a headshot and forget your offset you may not switch the bad guy's lights off, but you will likely ruin his day, and may put him off his game long enough to rectify the situation.
A very good reference that I picked up recently from another, possibly better, but still credentialed Firearms Instructor, fits well with "aim small, miss small". When deciding to take a headshot ask yourself if you can see your target's eyes. That is where you want to shoot anyway. If you can make out your target's eyes as you bring the gun up you are close enough YOU NEED TO OFFSET.
My thoughts, and worth about what you paid for them.
pat
Last edited by UNM1136; 10-09-2020 at 07:54 AM.
Exactly what would have written.
With the experience of the exercise described above repeat the drill holding the appropriate offset and put your rounds in the paster.
Up close, I taught to put the dot on the hairline if I want the rounds to go into the bridge of the nose. Would practice this by having a pad of the square (3”?) post it notes in my pocket. Put a post it note on the target where the rounds should go. Then have them put 3 rounds in the post it note on the command to fire.
They usually would forget everything about offset on the first run. I’d ask them to say, “hairline, hairline, hairline” to themselves as they do the next run on the drill. Usually worked out much better.
To the OP, short answer to your question In my opinion is to practice on a consistent basis.
Late to the party-based on my direct training experience in both sleep away carbine classes, competition and with agencies, the preferred methods is simply practicing offset with your carbine zeroed at 50 etc. which means holding high 0-15 ish at least. When I get ready to shoot a carbine up close, I say out loud to myself, offset, offset, offset.
IIRC, I once had a conversation with a former tac guy at grand jury, he said at his prior local agency, he just zeroed the red dot for for 5-7 yrds given the dimension of the houses/apartments he was entering on a daily basis. Mission Drives the Gear I suppose.
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