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Thread: Research on Ready Positions

  1. #11
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    Scotty Reitz is a fan of low ready too, based on comments he made at ITTS. And based on at least one recent LAPD shooting that was caught on badge cams, low ready is still in use by LAPD.

  2. #12
    Site Supporter JohnO's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark D View Post
    Scotty Reitz is a fan of low ready too, based on comments he made at ITTS. And based on at least one recent LAPD shooting that was caught on badge cams, low ready is still in use by LAPD.
    I read Uncle Scotty's book. There is a whole lot of Chuck Taylor's influence in there.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Casey View Post
    My understanding—from Bill's book and video, not personal experience—is that this refers to drawing to low ready without muzzling the target, then looking to confirm sight alignment, not sight picture, so that if it becomes necessary to shoot, one simply raises the gun to eye level by lifting with the arms without changing the angle of the wrists.
    That was my assumption as well. Checking sight alignment/picture by pointing at the target prior to going to low ready would defeat the purpose of going to low ready in a self defense scenario.

  4. #14
    "...defeat the purpose of going to low ready in a self defense scenario."

    Indeed it would, it would also insert an unfortunate complication into the body/badge cam video.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnO View Post
    I read Uncle Scotty's book. There is a whole lot of Chuck Taylor's influence in there.
    I think it would be more accurate to say there is a lot of old Gunsite influence there, which Taylor was associated with.

  6. #16
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    LAPD did a formal study on this back in the early 2000's, and I know Force Science has done some research as well. We heavily emphasize low ready in our training, though it is sometimes an uphill battle. Our Use of Force policy specifically makes pointing a firearm at someone a Reportable Use of Force, which means additional reporting and a supervisors investigation. Unfortunately, some of our cops think our emphasis on low ready is solely due to this policy, rather than for reasons of officer and public safety. It does not help that our Force Options Simulator Instructors, as well as some of the Defensive Tactics staff, directly contradict us in these issues. None of them are serious shooters, much less firearms instructors, so they know not from whence they speak. We're working on getting everyone on the same page. Its a struggle

  7. #17
    Site Supporter ST911's Avatar
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    Very recently, I was able to avoid shooting a dude because of practice drawing to a strong ready position and knowing how time related to the stuff I was doing. Much gratitude (esp from dude) and validation to my teachers and mentors advocating these concepts.
    الدهون القاع الفتيات لك جعل العالم هزاز جولة الذهاب

  8. #18
    Member Sal Picante's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erick Gelhaus View Post
    Oh, I’m really familiar with drawing to an actual low ready and working from there.

    My question must have been poorly worded or unclear ... if the gun is first sighted, then lowered, how do you sight the gun without muzzling the target?

    LOL - Chicken or Egg, bro! Right?

    I'll talk for a moment about my experience, keeping in mind the amazingly complex situations this might arise in. Keep in mind, I'm just a dude, not a cop, and presenting a firearm when not expressly warranted is a whole different kind of Pandora's box...

    I haven't practiced drawing on an ambiguous target - something that a cop may/may not need to do. I'm unsure how you'd confirm sights without actually getting to sights in a case like that. That said, having the access box complete checked already puts you ahead of the curve.

    In my experience from coursework with Kinetic Consulting doing deliberate clearing of a structure, setting up and taking a sight picture and confirming index under the sight line has been a real "ass saver" from shooting targets/people that didn't deserve to be shot. The concept really seems to mesh well with the "find the baseboards" method.

    IMHO there are two separate skills at play here that the Rogers technique merges into one action: the low ready aspect (timing) and the "pre-indexing" of sights (orientation)
    As positions changes, or movement becomes more prioritized, they will overlap less and less, but that's ok. For example, the skills doesn't seem to translate as completely of cleanly to something like USPSA, but there are some good takeaways: When approaching a position having the handgun indexed under the dominant eye eases some of the "aim through the barrier" setup skills. This stuff becomes really automatic from competition where those sub-seconds matter. This is where the timing "buffer" of the low ready position seems to help a bunch.

  9. #19
    Site Supporter Erick Gelhaus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Les Pepperoni View Post
    LOL - Chicken or Egg, bro! Right?
    Well, thank you for taking the time to reply.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Les Pepperoni View Post
    I haven't practiced drawing on an ambiguous target - something that a cop may/may not need to do.
    Drawing on an "ambiguous target" isn't just an issue for cops. Pointing a firearm at someone opens you to the possibility of being charged with aggravated assault unless it's blindingly obvious that you needed to, and depending on the political climate of where it takes place, you might be charged anyway.

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