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Thread: Sentinel Concepts: RDS Handgun

  1. #1

    Sentinel Concepts: RDS Handgun

    Steve Fisher RDS class

    “You don’t need an RDS class, this class is pointless” - Steve Fisher.

    Location: Mead Hall Range, east of Oklahoma City.
    Weather: Hot and sunny.
    Students: About 15 to 18 guys (I can't remember), mostly LE. No “That Guy.”
    Round ct: 250 - 300.

    First off, Meadhall Range is a very nice facility. It’s obvious that Bill is pouring his heart and soul into the facility. It’s basically one 300 yard range that can comfortably fit 10 or 12 shooters across. The range is mostly grass and slopes down hill. He has several shade structures, running water, air conditioned bathrooms with running water and an air conditioned classroom. We used the last 25 yards closest to the berm. He was very concerned about the user and instructors experience. He has quite the lineup in store for next year, so keep an eye on him if you’re in the area.

    Steve comes from an LE background, giving him a perspective that is very similar to Bolke and Dobbs. I imagine there’s a ton of overlap in their mentors. Like a HiTS class, he placed a strong emphasis on accountability and we poked holes in a lot of B8’s.

    The class: In his social media and throughout the class, Steve openly says he believes this class is pointless. You don’t need a RDS class to learn a red dot, you need to refine your support hand grip, presentation and roll through the trigger.

    We spent about an hour and a half in the classroom doing intros, the safety / medical brief, zeros, techniques and discussing equipment and mounting solution options. I doubt there’s any surprises here. He currently favors the ACRO, Holosun and Trijicon optics, pretty much in that order. He’s had a few RMR’s go down recently which puts them at the back of the GTG category. He has no use for any other currently available options. Mounting solutions: Direct mill is still king, MOS sucks, and CHPWS, Agency and some of the other plate systems are excellent.

    Preferred Zero: 25 yards.

    Out to the range.
    - We started out group shooting at 5, 7, 10, 15 and 25 yards. Several guys had trouble getting a consistent group, even at closer ranges. We spent a fair amount of time fixing that.
    - Draw to a target at various ranges: Singles, doubles and triples.
    - We spent a bit of time working techniques for occluded or failed RDS.
    - I think we ran out of time for SHO/WHO drills.
    - We ended the day with a slow fire 25 yard aggregate and a Super Test.
    - Steve has a large selection of guns and optics for you to experiment with.
    - Breaks were generous.

    As mentioned above, Steve placed particular emphasis on rolling through the trigger, support hand grip structure and presentation as keys to using a PMO.

    The following quote about Ben Stoeger could be equally applied to Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by GJM View Post
    Let me say right off, that you should not attend a Stoeger class if you are looking for pins, kudos or contagious enthusiasm for shooting. When you screw up, Ben tells you that succinctly, generally with “that sucked.” When you do well, you might get a “that was OK,” or “you are better at this aspect of shooting than X.” If other instructors would take your temperature orally or with a no touch wand, Ben does it rectally. Of course the benefit of this approach, is it removes ambiguity.
    All but a couple drills were shot on B-8’s. The black is acceptable, a few in the white was only acceptable if you were intentionally pushing yourself and could identify what you did to cause the miss. The USPSA A zone is way too generous.

    Steve wants you to get very comfortable shooting small targets and the speed of accountability. By contrast, Jedi’s class is about finding the limit of efficiency and your physical capabilities. If you can keep them in their appropriate context, the two classes supplement each other nicely.

    All in all, this was a pretty basic class. There was no secret sauce, just refining some fundamentals. I think it’s best suited for C and D class USPSA shooters, or equivalent. Of course, that’s the vast majority of shooters. B class and better probably won’t see any new techniques, but may benefit from the “100% accountability” perspective if they carry for personal protection.

    I agree that a RDS specific class isn’t strictly necessary if you already have the strong fundamentals and presentation that pistol optics demand. I was hoping for a one-day version of his Handgun Essentials class. I’m pretty sure that’s what I got.

    Hit me up if you have any questions.
    David S.

  2. #2
    Student
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    Arizona
    This is one of the better reviews I've read here in a while. Thank you for what you do with the training hub.

  3. #3
    Site Supporter
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Maryland
    I've read negative opinions of the MOS previously. Did Steve explain his thinking on this?

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by jnc36rcpd View Post
    I've read negative opinions of the MOS previously. Did Steve explain his thinking on this?
    I'm not a Glock guy so I didn't take notes on that particular segment.

    Fisher recommends C&H Precision for slide milling and MOS upgrades, so I assume Fisher agrees with Buck's explanation of the problem. He explains the problem, and why his solution is better here:

    ETA: Explanation starts at 1m:30s

    Last edited by David S.; 09-07-2020 at 08:28 AM.
    David S.

  5. #5
    Site Supporter
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Maryland
    Thanks, Dave. Very informative video.

  6. #6
    Site Supporter SeriousStudent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Texas
    Thanks David, I had been wondering the same thing. Much appreciated.

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