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Thread: Are we good with Sig now?

  1. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by shane45 View Post
    On the topic of commercial vs Gov't contract. I pulled my M18 apart over the weekend. While apart I noticed that the internals looked like the ones pictured found here:

    https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....oncerns/page10

    What I found was that the parts on my commercial M18 match the pictures of the DHS pistol in the referenced thread with the exception of the barrel. That doesnt match either picture, Im assuming due to the loaded chamber indicator. But the slide machining matches. The FCU finish and all markings match up. I got one of the first M18's to hit shelves. Im wondering if all M18's are indeed more akin to Govt guns or fist ones out used over runs and current ones use civilian 320 parts? Anyone else have an M18?
    The sheer number of P320s owned by civilians makes me suspicious of that thread. Many P320s used in IDPA and no reports of the gun firing unmolested.

  2. #172
    Quote Originally Posted by JonInWA View Post
    I'm moderately confident that 2019 P320s are debugged (and for an even higher confidence level, P320s made from May 31 2019 on); I'm less confident that SIG has a viable QC program applicable to all guns they manufacture. An inadequate, or lack of a viable QC program seems to be an emdemic and systemic SIG issue. At least it's an issue I have with SIG.

    Best, Jon
    Hi Jon,

    What is it about the post May 2019 P320 that changed to make them debugged?

    Rob

  3. #173
    Site Supporter JonInWA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by roboster2013 View Post
    Hi Jon,

    What is it about the post May 2019 P320 that changed to make them debugged?

    Rob
    Because earlier in the discussion thread, we had a p-f member who had one with a production date of 31 May that SIG informed him was a recipient of the modifications and was good to go; that's the earliest confirmed date we have, as SIG has otherwise been mute on specifically nailing down when the modification start date was.

    Best, Jon

  4. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sammy1 View Post
    The sheer number of P320s owned by civilians makes me suspicious of that thread. Many P320s used in IDPA and no reports of the gun firing unmolested.
    No reports you are aware of.

    IDPA is a fraction of a fraction of active shooters much less gun owners. Most civilian guns are never shot or are shot once.

    There are plenty of reports documented in the July 2020 lawsuit filing though, in fairness some of those were NDs not ADs. Many of the actual ADs are LE related, simply because LE carry, handle, and knock around pistols more than civilians.

    I’m pretty confident SIG has figured out the “how” of making a truly drop safe P320.

    Whether SIG can execute that design consistently is a separate issue.

    SIG has made over 1,000,000 P320s. If the filing in the July 2020 lawsuit is accurate less than 20% of the original design P320s have been sent in for the “voluntary upgrade.”

    SIG is not the first fully tensioned striker gun to have documented instances of firing in a duty holster after a sharp impact. See the FN FNS. FN was able to fix this issue in the 509 but it was a thing.

  5. #175
    Site Supporter Trukinjp13's Avatar
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    Idk if I will ever be good with Sig again. But I do know people who have bought varying models in the past couple years and the majority of them had some sort of issue one way or another.

    So putting my opinion aside. Sig fucked up with the voluntary program. That was a joke. They should have made it a recall. Brought them all back in house and fixed the damn things if they had a fix. Without wrangling all the pistols that fell in it and fixing them the proper way. You are going to be fighting demons forever. The problem pistols will be out there and at that. The majority of pistols built wrong will still be out there.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  6. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trukinjp13 View Post
    Idk if I will ever be good with Sig again. But I do know people who have bought varying models in the past couple years and the majority of them had some sort of issue one way or another.

    So putting my opinion aside. Sig fucked up with the voluntary program. That was a joke. They should have made it a recall. Brought them all back in house and fixed the damn things if they had a fix. Without wrangling all the pistols that fell in it and fixing them the proper way. You are going to be fighting demons forever. The problem pistols will be out there and at that. The majority of pistols built wrong will still be out there.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I agree. The attorneys here May correct me but I feel like saying open themselves up to liability by making this a voluntary upgrade instead of a recall. Issuing a clear recall would’ve put the burden on owners to send them back.

  7. #177
    Site Supporter Trukinjp13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HCM View Post
    I agree. The attorneys here May correct me but I feel like saying open themselves up to liability by making this a voluntary upgrade instead of a recall. Issuing a clear recall would’ve put the burden on owners to send them back.
    That’s what I have been wondering. Seems like in the automotive world, if you had a failing seatbelt. It would be a automatic recall for safety.


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  8. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trukinjp13 View Post
    That’s what I have been wondering. Seems like in the automotive world, if you had a failing seatbelt. It would be a automatic recall for safety.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    The best part is I’ve heard several people say they don’t want to send their 320s in for the “upgrade” because the unaltered guns will be “collectible” sone day.

    It’s a damn disposable pistol...

  9. #179
    Member jd950's Avatar
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    I am not seeing collectible. A couple local shops are refusing ANY P320 as a trade in. One local agency has banned all P320s from service and another simply bans any p320 made before some post-upgrade date, regardless of whether the gun was sent in or not. I am a DA guy for the most part, but nonetheless, am having trouble understanding what a P320 could do for me that a Glock or M&P could not, without the drama. And, I am not not a Sig hater. Happily shoot Classic p series and even the p250s. Don't own a single P320, but would have gotten one to play with if not for all the unknowns.

    ETA: Of course, other shops cannot keep them in stock and one agency I am very familiar with thinks they are the best thing since sliced bread.

  10. #180
    Quote Originally Posted by LittleLebowski View Post

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