Taurus® Defender 856 38 SPECIAL +P

[JWintergreen]

All S&W needs to do is reintroduce the M12 in a scandium frame, fixed sights and a 3" barrel, no lock, and I will be happy. I know the short lived nightguard version was very close to this, but we all know the sad tale of how they introduced new guns right in time for the great recession.

If Ruger would upsize the LCR or LCRX to 6 shots and use the 3" barrel they already sell on the 5 shot frame on it, I would buy a couple, maybe three of those.

It sucks that Taurus is the one who introduced the enlightened design I have imagined. It tempts me even more when I see their orange front sight with a tritium vial as part of that package. If I trusted them at all I would go buy a couple of 856 3" airweights as soon as I could find them.

I have thought of this as well, and always come back to the all steel 6 shot .38/.357 SP101 camp. A (.357 and 9mm variant) D frame sized LCR would fall in between the J frame sized LCR and SP101 in weight. This would cause a lot of internal competition and would not be good from a marketing standpoint. A 6 shot SP101, with the aforementioned changes, would be about identical in weight to the second frame size (allowed longer than 125 grain bullets in .357) and still take advantage of almost all SP101 accessories. It would also renew interest in an older product line and perfectly fill that gap bewteen the LCR and GP100 from a marketing perspective.

Recent production alloy frame Smiths have not had the best reputation. The stories on the S&W forum are both entertaining and horrifying to read. The beauty of an all steel D frame sized gun is durability, comfortable practice, and a greater ease of carry compared to medium frame guns. Also, the Model 12 might be light, but it is still dimensionally a medium frame revolver. The lock is not going anywhere, anytime soon. Some folks say this is due to lawsuit fears, but Ruger has removed locks from some models and did not get sued into oblivion. I have always thought that the main reason S&W will not do this, is due to the frame shape changes. If they removed the locks, they would be obligated to go back to the original frame shapes and they don't seem keen on spending much coin on their revolver line.

[JWintergreen]

I've got a Colt DS that's a good carry gun, but I much prefer the trigger on a S&W. There seems to be a renaissance of revolvers for CCW use; a lot of people have seemed to figure out that they print less and in the high 90th percentile of self-defense incidents, six shots is more than enough for people who avoid violating the Triple-Stupid Rule.

So reading about the Model 73 breaks my heart. Especially when of the four possible choices for a smallish-frame carry gun, two of the companies have a reputation for iffy quality control and the other two for iffy customer service.

Which leaves really one company that doesn't make the guns that could and they'd probably sell out in half of a jiffy.

So, I guess I'm going to rock on with my snubbie Model 19 for the foreseeable future.

My thoughts exactly. When I first read about the demise of the Model 73, I double facepalmed for a solid minute or two. I will keep packing my 3" GP100, but I am not happy about it. Medium frame guns and N frames are great for field use, but the D frame sized guns are perfect for revolver people that want something more substantial than a J frame that can still be easily concealed and carried all day.

Hopefully, Ruger finally listens to people that have been asking for this for many years.

[OlongJohnson]

Recent production alloy frame Smiths have not had the best reputation. The stories on the S&W forum are both entertaining and horrifying to read.

My experience is two for two with them needing significant parts replaced in order to be serviceable. In one case, S&W did not have said parts available, rendering the unit non-serviceable for all time.

I have always thought that the main reason S&W will not do this, is due to the frame shape changes. If they removed the locks, they would be obligated to go back to the original frame shapes and they don't seem keen on spending much coin on their revolver line.

I don't see how any such obligation follows. There are lock and no-lock versions of guns. Just don't drilll the damn hole in the side. Sure, there are people who prefer the line on the pre-lock guns, but 99 percent of us would be happy enough to just not have the hole.

[JWintergreen]

My experience is two for two with them needing significant parts replaced in order to be serviceable. In one case, S&W did not have said parts available, rendering the unit non-serviceable for all time.



I don't see how any such obligation follows. There are lock and no-lock versions of guns. Just don't drilll the damn hole in the side. Sure, there are people who prefer the line on the pre-lock guns, but 99 percent of us would be happy enough to just not have the hole.

I'm sorry about your alloy frame Smith experiences. QC is not good in any company right now when it comes to revolvers. I have also heard other stories of people being stuck with S&W paperweights.

As for the difference in pre lock vs post lock K,L,N frame shapes, revolver traditionalists can be VERY picky. Sometimes this is a good thing (prevents change for the sake of change) and sometimes this stands in the way of potentially positive changes or new offerings. The extra steel above the cylinder release is homely and there would be some folks that would start shrieking about how that needs to be changed next. However, I agree with you. I would just like to see that horrible monstrosity go away and I don't care if they take the cheap way out.

[CSW]

Plan on putting another 50 or so rounds thru the 856 this week. That'll bring the round count to just over 200.
I'm gonna load up some 158 hard cast at normal 38-special tolerances, to see how she does. That'll also eat up any and all small pistol primers I have. If the hard cast hit to poa/poi, it could very well be the 'pet load' for this little gun.

Been dry firing it with snaps, and the D/A trigger is getting smoother, to the point that the grit is almost non existant.....but still heavy. Overall, it has run fine, and I really like the size of it as well.

Ordered a set of faux ivory boot grips for it. I'll post a pic when they are mounted up.

[HoustonGP100]

I did some gun shop trolling this weekend. I saw two 856 defenders at two different shops priced at 540.00. WTH.

[vaglocker]

I did some gun shop trolling this weekend. I saw two 856 defenders at two different shops priced at 540.00. WTH.

Was surprised to see one at a local gun show recently (black matte version) for just under msrp go figure. Seems like prices on these are all over the place, but it also appears supply is starting to catch up at least locally.

[FrankB]

FWIW... I bought two S&W 642 revolvers a year ago, and they’ve both performed flawlessly. I’m kind of picky, and use a micrometer and loupe to examine my firearms, along with actually firing and carrying them.

[MDFA]

So far I've fired 100 rds thru my 856. No issues with it. When I got it home I cleaned the internals and examined it. The internal finish was as good or better than my recent manufacture S&W's. After lubing it and some dry fire I checked the trigger pull. Double action was off the reading of my Lyman digital gauge and single action was around 6.5 lbs. I changed the mainspring and rebound spring with a set from Galloway Precision, which has given it a 7.3 Double action and a 4.1 Single action pull average over 10 trigger pulls in each mode. I think that will get better with dry fire as parts wear in. I've tried my Comp 2 speedloaders, which work but do bind. I then tried HKS DS loaders for the Detective Special which seem to work the best. Metal CD holders work well as do Split 6 holders. I'm carrying Buffalo Bore 158 LSWCHP +p which hit closest to POA/POI but are still a bit high. More manageable than when fired in an Airweight though. I ordered a JMCK AIWB Holster for a 3 inch J Frame. I loosened the screws and warmed the holster with a heat gun (Just Warmed NOT Softened) I put the gun in the holster and tightened the screws a bit, once cooled I adjusted the screws for final fit and it works fine. Should you choose to do this, you do so at your own risk. And I do not hold Tony responsible for any issues with the holster, as I have chosen to alter it. (I don't expect there will be any). I have s set of Eagle Secret Service Boot Grips on order. Hope this helps anyone who's looking for gear for their 856.

[jandbj]

Eager to hear how the Galloway springs work out in live fire. I may need a few sets of those.