HK P2000 to G19 Transition Observations

[Doc_Glock]

My Brother in Law is a CBP agent of 15 years or so and is going to transition to the G19 soon from the P2000 in .40 he has carried, trained with and qualified with his entire career.

I would describe him as a careful shooter, but not an avid one he got some award for shooting excellence at FLETC, but hasn’t shot much outside of quarterly (now semi) annual qualifications since. So, probably he has shot less then 5,000 rounds lifetime, 2K of that at FLETC. He’s not a gun guy. But he carries off duty pretty much always. He’s safe.

We took him out for familiarization with my G5G19 MOS. No optic
installed, just bold sights. I think that mimics what will be his duty pistol.

He liked it. And it liked him. He was mostly black on a B8 at 5 yards and was able to keep it on an IDPA target at 25.

Ran him through “The Test” at 10 yards: 83 down one, with the first shot thrown barely off target. Time was 14 seconds. Kinda slow but he makes his hits.



The only concern I noticed was he doubled the trigger at least five times in 150 rounds. Essentially firing a second unintended shot rapidly after the first. Kind of a bump fire situation. It got better as he got used to the gun, and honestly none of those doubles was a crazy wild shot. They ended up on the target.

I had him try my LCP just to run some rounds through it and he did fine once he learned the heavier trigger.

We ended the day with him shooting a few mags through his duty P2000 before reloading and holstering that up.

I think the five yard targets are revealing:

Glock:


P2000 V2 LEM

I don’t think he will miss the P2000 much. But he was pretty sad when he heard it will be tossed in a shredder since it has been his companion for many years.

Despite my user name I have a great affinity for HK pistols. But whenever I hand a non enthusiast shooter a LEM, their performance at shooting drops like a rock. But he didn’t have any unintended doubles, so there is that. I personally think the swap to the Glock and 9mm will be a great for qualification scores for CBP.

[Tokarev]

We've only transitioned a handful of shooters in my area. Official transition will start in October but we went ahead and did a few courses just to work out the round counts and times for what we want to do.

Anyway, so far, nobody is sad to see the P2000 go. It is a hard gun to shoot and even harder to shoot well. The LEM trigger is simply unnecessary and not worth the effort.

Scores have gone up a little but I accredit that to the dry fire and live fire warm up before we shoot for score. I imagine once the newness wears off we'll see good shooters are still good. Bad shooters will still be bad. But there will probably be a small amount of improvement just based off the trigger alone.

There will be some grip issues and people bumping slide releases and having to learn a new mag release but, so far, everyone is eager to kiss the P2000 goodbye. I won't miss it.

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[jh9]

Does HK have any other large institutional users of the P2000? I wonder if they plan to discontinue the model.

[HCM]

CBP OFO ( Office of Field Operations- the blue suiters at the ports of entry) use a 36 round qualification course which only goes out to 15 yards and has minimal tine pressure. Your BIL likely hasn’t shot a 25 yards target since he left FLETC so he is doing better than his peers. Most LE Quals are not particularly challenging but the OFO qual is one of the least demanding federal quality courses. For reference the USBP uses a completely different and more challenging qualification course.

From a shooting and qualifications score point of view you are probably right that qualification scores will go up although I suspect that will be as much a function of going from a 40 to a 9mm rather than going from LEM to the Glock.

The good thing about the Glock is it easy to shoot, the bad thing about the Glock for minimally trained people is it is easy to shoot. I say this because they will be doing a lot more administrative handling and pointing weapons at people than shooting. I have the same concern with my own agencies transition to the P320.

As with agencies which issued TDA Guns, many longtime LEM carriers have developed (and gotten away with) bad habits like “trigger checking” in stressful situations As such expect to see a rise in negligent discharges as seen with LASD’s transition from the Beretta 92 to the S&W M&P.

Training can mitigate this but based on past experience with OFO I think it’s unlikely they will invest the necessary time in such training.

[HCM]

Does HK have any other large institutional users of the P2000? I wonder if they plan to discontinue the model.

Not in the US.

[jh9]

Not in the US.

Ouch. Hopefully they continue to import or at least support it. I just sold most of my striker guns and bought a couple LEM P2000s, holsters, mags, etc. not all that long ago.

[HCM]

Ouch. Hopefully they continue to import or at least support it. I just sold most of my striker guns and bought a couple LEM P2000s, holsters, mags, etc. not all that long ago.

I don’t think HK has supplied anything to CBP in some time but 45,000 P2000 carriers definitely help boost the limited aftermarket support for the P2000.

They do have other international customers using the P2000 and USPC.

[Tokarev]

Does HK have any other large institutional users of the P2000? I wonder if they plan to discontinue the model.

I think the P2000 is already out of production. Not discontinued but rather not being produced.

The good news is that some of the internal parts are the same for the P30.

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[Tokarev]

CBP OFO ( Office of Field Operations- the blue suiters at the ports of entry) use a 36 round qualification course which only goes out to 15 yards and has minimal tine pressure. Your BIL likely hasn’t shot a 25 yards target since he left FLETC so he is doing better than his peers. Most LE Quals are not particularly challenging but the OFO qual is one of the least demanding federal quality courses.

@Screwball can comment more but I believe OFO is now using a 50rd qual that includes something like eight rounds from 25.

USBP is still rocking the same Q we've had for 20 years although there are some rumblings about going to a 50rd course.

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[CCT125US]

I think the P2000 is already out of production. Not discontinued but rather not being produced.

The good news is that some of the internal parts are the same for the P30.

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P2000 v2 is my preferred carry gun. This would be unfortunate news to my wallet...