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Thread: EDCL1-T and K2 Batteries

  1. #21
    Marginally Relevant NH Shooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Cid View Post
    I struggle to understand candela. Lol!




    In the above photo;

    Lumens = luminous flux
    Candela = luminous intensity
    Lux = illuminance

    Lumens (luminous flux) is the total amount of light a source emits in all directions. A bare 100-watt light bulb emits about 1700 lumens.

    Candela (luminous intensity) is how bright a light source appears to the eye as a point source. The 100-watt bulb is 1700 lumens, but is easy to look directly at because those lumens are spread out all around the bulb (low luminous intensity).

    On the opposite side of the spectrum from the light bulb is a laser - very, very low lumens but is very tightly focused into a very narrow beam. Lasers are eye-damaging bright even though the total output of light (luminous flux) is very low.

    With flashlights, lumens only tells us the volume of light it produces. If a 650 lumen flashlight has a broad, even beam its luminous intensity (candela) will be low. If those 650 lumens are more tightly concentrated into a narrow beam, its candela (or how bright it appears to someone looking into the beam) will be higher (in some cases, much higher).

    Thus the question becomes is what is the light going to be used for? How do you want to "spend" those lumens - to illuminate a wide area or to to reach out and light-up an object far away?

    The light I posted above is "only" 650 lumens but those lumens are tightly focused into a 70,000 candela beam, making much more like a laser than a light bulb. It can reach out a very long distance to illuminate an object, or can be used to overwhelm the vision of an assailant. The tactics for using a light configured this way are pretty well documented.

    So I carry two lights - one with a wide, general purpose beam for administrative tasks and the "light saber" for "stabbing" an assailant in the eyes.

    I hope this explanation helps!

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by 10mmfanboy View Post
    I use power2000 rechargeable in several lights, they are lifeP04 3.2 v .I use them in a malkoff mdc ha and a surefire edcl1 and all modes work fine in both, however expect much shorter run times, especially on high. I only get between 21 and 29 min of runtime on high on the malkoff vs 50 ish minutes with a primary cr123 on high. If the light isn't designed for lithium rechargeable (such as my malkoff light) it is imperative to use a protected cell, as the light does not feature low voltage protection and drops down into direct drive once the voltage gets too low. I also use energitech rcr 16340 in both lights and they run fine as well, although you will lose your low settings, but gain longer runtimes. If your light is going to be a dedicated fighting light I'd suggest just sticking with primary cells.

    I use 16650 orbtronic batteries in anything 2x 123 configuration. I don't notice much difference in runtimes, however I can tell in my surefire e2t- mv tactician that brightness suffers a little on high. Instead of a claimed 800 lumens it's probably more like 600 ish lumens, still plenty bright and probably wouldn't notice a difference unless you try both back to back.

    My suggestion as a flashaholic is to forget malkoffs and surefires because quite honestly I have been underwhelmed with all of them. 18650 and 18350 batteries are much more efficient for heavy users of flashlights. And if a light can't be configured to suit ones needs nowadays then it's about 10 years behind the curve. I use guppydrv3 firmware in all my lights I modify or build, and have never had an issue losing modes or what not, and I beat the dog tar piss out of them.
    Ok, if youíre regularly changing the firmware in your flashlights, youíre officially operating on another plane compared to me!
    That said, I have adopted the 18650 for several of the higher output lights in our house. What makes of flashlight to you prefer that can easily accept those batteries? (Preferably without firmware updates).

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by NH Shooter View Post



    In the above photo;

    Lumens = luminous flux
    Candela = luminous intensity
    Lux = illuminance

    Lumens (luminous flux) is the total amount of light a source emits in all directions. A bare 100-watt light bulb emits about 1700 lumens.

    Candela (luminous intensity) is how bright a light source appears to the eye as a point source. The 100-watt bulb is 1700 lumens, but is easy to look directly at because those lumens are spread out all around the bulb (low luminous intensity).

    On the opposite side of the spectrum from the light bulb is a laser - very, very low lumens but is very tightly focused into a very narrow beam. Lasers are eye-damaging bright even though the total output of light (luminous flux) is very low.

    With flashlights, lumens only tells us the volume of light it produces. If a 650 lumen flashlight has a broad, even beam its luminous intensity (candela) will be low. If those 650 lumens are more tightly concentrated into a narrow beam, its candela (or how bright it appears to someone looking into the beam) will be higher (in some cases, much higher).

    Thus the question becomes is what is the light going to be used for? How do you want to "spend" those lumens - to illuminate a wide area or to to reach out and light-up an object far away?

    The light I posted above is "only" 650 lumens but those lumens are tightly focused into a 70,000 candela beam, making much more like a laser than a light bulb. It can reach out a very long distance to illuminate an object, or can be used to overwhelm the vision of an assailant. The tactics for using a light configured this way are pretty well documented.

    So I carry two lights - one with a wide, general purpose beam for administrative tasks and the "light saber" for "stabbing" an assailant in the eyes.

    I hope this explanation helps!
    Yes - thank you!

  4. #24
    Site Supporter JCS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elwin View Post
    This is a long shot, but I'll throw it out here in hopes that there may be some battery nerds here who could help, so that I don't have to go join another forum. I'm all kinds of nerd, but batteries/electronics is very much not my thing.

    I bought a set of K2 rechargeable CR123 batteries and the matching charger in hopes that I'd have a rechargeable solution for my Surefire EDCL1-T, which is my EDC and nightstand light. It covers both task and "tactical" roles for me. Rechargeables would be great, because I wouldn't have to play the guessing game as to when my batteries are worn down enough by tasks that I need to replace them to ensure emergency reliability.

    I went with the K2s because my understanding is that they were previously sold with Surefire branding as a rechargeable option for multiple Surefire lights, including the EDCL1-T. However, on trying mine, I have the issue that I've seen reported regarding other brands of rechargeable 123s - my light will run with them on low, but high mode won't engage. High mode currently works as usual with a normal CR123.

    Is there any "fix" for this, or something obvious I'm missing? Or was there a running change to Surefire's wiring that makes the light incompatible with these cells? Light was purchased in April of 2019. Thanks in advance for any advice, even if it's just "go register on a flashlight forum."
    I wanted to provide an update for you. I've had the same problem and have been waiting on Surefire's new rcr123a's. They did not work either. I called Surefire and they said the first version of the light do not work with rechargeable's. They offered to replace the light to the upgraded version (great customer service!). They sent me a shipping label and I'm sending the light in.

    TLDR. Contact Surefire and they'll get you a new light.
    Diligentia Vis Celeritas

    SDG

  5. #25
    Damnable 1911 Heretic Elwin's Avatar
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    Apr 2020
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    Midwest
    Thanks a lot for the heads up! Iíd been wondering if the new Surefires would work but now I have my answer and a solution. I must have gotten new old stock when I bought my light, I havenít had it that long.

  6. #26
    I was curious about the new Surefire branded rechargeables (with the USB charger). Is there a list somewhere of what Surefire LED lights are compatible with these (or the older K2 version)?

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by JCS View Post
    I wanted to provide an update for you. I've had the same problem and have been waiting on Surefire's new rcr123a's. They did not work either. I called Surefire and they said the first version of the light do not work with rechargeable's. They offered to replace the light to the upgraded version (great customer service!). They sent me a shipping label and I'm sending the light in.

    TLDR. Contact Surefire and they'll get you a new light.

    Thanks, all, for the heads up on potential issues with the EDCL1-T. I have an early one, as well...glad to hear their customer service made that right. This certainly seems to suggest they *should* be compatible:

    https://surefire.news/surefire-sflfp123-batteries/


    @JCS, where did you find the new rechargeables/charger? Looks they are out of stock everywhere, including Surefire.

  8. #28
    Site Supporter JCS's Avatar
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    Oct 2014
    Location
    Oklahoma
    Quote Originally Posted by Gater View Post
    Thanks, all, for the heads up on potential issues with the EDCL1-T. I have an early one, as well...glad to hear their customer service made that right. This certainly seems to suggest they *should* be compatible:

    https://surefire.news/surefire-sflfp123-batteries/


    @JCS, where did you find the new rechargeables/charger? Looks they are out of stock everywhere, including Surefire.
    I had placed an order back in April. When I talked to them they said they had a huge amount of backlogged orders.
    Diligentia Vis Celeritas

    SDG

  9. #29
    Just remember, rechargeable 123ís have less than half the runtime of disposables. A good solution for utility lights used regularly, perhaps not so much for fighting lights.

  10. #30
    Member 10mmfanboy's Avatar
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    Sep 2018
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    TN
    Quote Originally Posted by GyroF-16 View Post
    Ok, if youíre regularly changing the firmware in your flashlights, youíre officially operating on another plane compared to me!
    That said, I have adopted the 18650 for several of the higher output lights in our house. What makes of flashlight to you prefer that can easily accept those batteries? (Preferably without firmware updates).
    Sadly, it seems most USA companies have not excepted the fact that 18650 and 21700 batteries are far superior to stupid cr123 batteries. But there are all kinds you can buy that are quality, depends what size you want it in, candela... if you want just tactical lights than you can get options from malkoff devices and a couple from surefire as well. I believe streamlight have many options for 18650 as well as olight, but I hate proprietary batteries and will never own any flashlight that uses proprietary batteries. I am also a total tint snob so I can't suggest any of the previous brands for the disgusting tint they offer as well.

    Jetbeam, Acebeam, Armytek, all have been stellar for me and come in neutral or warm tints. I cannot recommend Convoy flashlights enough. You can either buy them whole and choose led and firmware or build your own ( it's not very hard ) Their C8+ with osram is a ridiculous thrower, looks like a laser beam tight focus and it goes further than I can even see. Their M1 and M2 are great tactical size lights, Randy from PFlexPro built one of them for me and is fully potted like a malkoff. Only it takes 18650 battery and has 22 modes to choose from

    I have built probably 50 lights now for me and others and cost a fraction of the price and will outperform anything else I've had, fully pot those as well, even though they don't really need it in flashlights anymore. I spent half a day trying to kill a $9 ultrafire 501 (p60 clone) throwing it up in the air as high as I could at least 20 times. Threw it against a metal fence for the heck of it. Put it on my 12 gauge and had a 100 round clay pigeon friendly tournament out back and it never did break. So, I just left it be and didn't bother making a new drop in for it. I trust that light more than any surefire, malkoff I own lol.

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