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Thread: New 2 July 2020 SIG P320 Lawsuit and P320 Concerns

  1. #471
    Says s&W in the article

  2. #472
    Site Supporter Lon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by newyork View Post
    Says s&W in the article
    That’s what I get for relying on someone else’s info and being too lazy to read the entire article. Post removed cuz I’m a dumbass.
    Formerly known as xpd54.
    The opinions expressed in this post are my own and do not reflect the opinions or policies of my employer.
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  3. #473
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    Quote Originally Posted by Polecat View Post
    I am curious, are Bruce Gray and Rick engineers or gunsmiths? If they are gunsmiths, offering ideas is one thing, designing and engineering guns an entirely other end of the spectrum. Also, just who were the “engineers” and how much experience did they have before they turned them loose on the 320?
    Bruce Gray is an actual Engineer who became a gunsmith. Bruce has been THE go to gunsmith for SIG and HK since the 1980s. Bruce has been a gunsmith for over 40 years - so he had at least 30 years experience when providing input on the 320/365.

  4. #474
    Quote Originally Posted by HCM View Post
    Bruce Gray is an actual Engineer who became a gunsmith. Bruce has been THE go to gunsmith for SIG and HK since the 1980s. Bruce has been a gunsmith for over 40 years - so he had at least 30 years experience when providing input on the 320/365.
    I believe the point is that he had zero actual experience engineering guns from a design perspective prior to this. Doing trigger jobs on existing designs seems a bit far off from designing from the ground up.

  5. #475
    Quote Originally Posted by HCM View Post
    Bruce Gray is an actual Engineer who became a gunsmith. Bruce has been THE go to gunsmith for SIG and HK since the 1980s. Bruce has been a gunsmith for over 40 years - so he had at least 30 years experience when providing input on the 320/365.
    Do we know the extent of his input? Did he just look at a 250 and tell them to make it striker fired with a nice trigger? Or was he actually working on the design

  6. #476
    Actual PE or just job title?

    'Engineer' is a very broad term. PE isn't necessarily common in some disciplines. In some disciplines it probably should be.

  7. #477
    Quote Originally Posted by jh9 View Post
    Actual PE or just job title?

    'Engineer' is a very broad term. PE isn't necessarily common in some disciplines. In some disciplines it probably should be.
    Sadly, having passed the PE guarantees neither competence nor common sense. I've also seen a goodly number of extremely good engineers who just aren't good test takers. I guess that applies everywhere-lawyers, doctors, etc...

  8. #478
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thy.Will.Be.Done View Post
    I believe the point is that he had zero actual experience engineering guns from a design perspective prior to this. Doing trigger jobs on existing designs seems a bit far off from designing from the ground up.
    Bruce had extensive experience designing and engineering parts for SIG and HK, in particular parts to correct the functional issues with the steel frame P220s and he was involved in the design of the SIG P220 in 10mm.

    Not quite the same as a completely new design but a hell of a lot more than “doing trigger jobs.”

    Then again, the 320 was not a “clean sheet” design. It’s a modification of the P250. The prototype P320s were literally modified P250s.

    Speaking of trigger jobs, Bruce developed the process SIG adopted for production of the improved trigger / hammer/sear found in the hammer fired legion models.
    Last edited by HCM; 09-24-2022 at 09:10 AM.

  9. #479
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zman001 View Post
    Do we know the extent of his input? Did he just look at a 250 and tell them to make it striker fired with a nice trigger? Or was he actually working on the design
    My understanding is SIG did the initial design which then went back and forth between SIG and Bruce.

    When the 320 was first released to the public Bruce had one of the prototype P320s built from a P250 with him at classes.

  10. #480
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    Here is a YouTube video of someone giving their account of their 320 going off in holster at a steel challenge. He is pretty clear, concise, and detailed in how it happened and discussing his gear.


    https://youtu.be/FBjo62vSYZk

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