https://pre64win.com

[okie john]

From that time period? Aside from Mannlicher's full stocked rifles and some WWI-to-WWII-era military bolt rifles, none really. I was comparing them to more modern rifles. Maybe that's the issue, the mystique came from comparison to its peers at the time and is not really relevant in today's world?

Chris

Yes.

Sporting rifles were hard to find after WWII since most of our manufacturing capacity had been devoted to making military weapons since late 1941. That's why so many military rifles from that period were converted (with varying degrees of refinement) into sporters. The Model 70 was a modern, updated small-ring Mauser action with modern metallurgy so you didn't have to worry about it blowing up. It was chambered for a wide range of modern cartridges from the factory so it cycled properly. It also had a superb trigger, and you didn't have to modify the safety to clear a scope. The Featherweight was the equivalent of a Kimber Montana.

Remington filled the void with the 721 and 722, which lacked the Model 70's cosmetic refinement. European arms makers also stepped in since they desperately needed hard currency, and you started to see superb Mauser-actioned rifles from Sako, Husqvarna, FN, Browning, and others, some sold as the house brands of chain stores like Sears and Montgomery Ward (JC Higgins and Western Field, respectively). There were also similar rifles of lower quality from Parker-Hale and others.

The pre-64 Winchester Model 70 was among the most refined of them, plus it was made in America at a time when we dominated the world. It's still a solid piece of gear today, but if it were a car, it would be something like a 57 Chevy.


Okie John

[Jim Watson]

There is a lot of nostalgia there, too.
My 1950s sporter and 1942-55 Target are not as accurate as current stainless and plastic and not as weatherproof either.
But they will still kill game and hit most targets.

Shotgunner Don Zutz took a Rifleman's Holiday with a prewar Target in .250 Savage. He fed it new bullets and found it substantially more accurate than old accounts. He concluded that there had been more improvements in bullets than in barrels 1930s-1980s.
Looking at those old accounts, you will also find that the old-timers had the bad habit of shooting ten shot groups, which would not fit the modern advertising approach.

[OlongJohnson]

Paging @GJM

[rob_s]

This is that I want
https://pre64win.com/collections/rif...ght-rifle-1954

My question is this...

Assuming it was available, it's $1,500. is there a reliable 'smith that could take a new production featherweight, cut and thread the barrel, and install barrel-mounted irons, and get me out the door for less than $1,500?

[Duces Tecum]

A little more opinion . . .

https://revivaler.com/the-winchester...nt-production/

[okie john]

This is that I want
https://pre64win.com/collections/rif...ght-rifle-1954

My question is this...

Assuming it was available, it's $1,500. is there a reliable 'smith that could take a new production featherweight, cut and thread the barrel, and install barrel-mounted irons, and get me out the door for less than $1,500?

Gunbroker shows Model 70 FWT compacts for under $900, which might eliminate the need for cutting the barrel. There’s a like-new Standard FWT for $675 and several NIB FWTs for just over $800.

Getting out the door for under $1,500 seems doable, but it depends on your end goal and even then we’re still talking apples and oranges. According to several sources that I trust, a current production FWT will be more precise in general. It will also be a true short action as opposed the pre-64, which is a 30/06-length, so it will be lighter and will balance differently. You can also get the new one in stainless. The pre-64 will have the old-style trigger, which a lot of folks prefer.


Okie John

[rob_s]

Gunbroker shows Model 70 FWT compacts for under $900, which might eliminate the need for cutting the barrel. There’s a like-new Standard FWT for $675 and several NIB FWTs for just over $800.

Getting out the door for under $1,500 seems doable, but it depends on your end goal and even then we’re still talking apples and oranges. According to several sources that I trust, a current production FWT will be more precise in general. It will also be a true short action as opposed the pre-64, which is a 30/06-length, so it will be lighter and will balance differently. You can also get the new one in stainless. The pre-64 will have the old-style trigger, which a lot of folks prefer.


Okie John

Ultimately I just want a M70 with barrel-mounted irons. If it can also be threaded for a can mount, even better. I don't have too much nostalgia about it either way.

That's a good point about the long action though.

[mtnbkr]

Ultimately I just want a M70 with barrel-mounted irons. If it can also be threaded for a can mount, even better. I don't have too much nostalgia about it either way.

That's a good point about the long action though.

I have a 2002ish FWT 6.5x55. The barrel is pretty skinny. I'm certain the muzzle is too narrow to thread for a can. If you were to cut it back far enough, it might get thick enough, but I haven't measured.

I've been tempted to put irons on mine as well, but never followed through.

Chris

[TGS]

Yes.

Sporting rifles were hard to find after WWII since most of our manufacturing capacity had been devoted to making military weapons since late 1941. That's why so many military rifles from that period were converted (with varying degrees of refinement) into sporters.

Sporting rifle production was depressed post-war because almost every nation in the world had their bolt action inventory on whole-sale, which could be bought and converted into a sporter for cheaper than a newly built hunting rifle.

It wasn't because of a lack of sporting rifle production, or because the factories were somehow unable to switch over to sporting rifle production because of WWII production lines. Wartime production can swing into sporter production on the fly without any heartache.

The Model 70 was a modern, updated small-ring Mauser action with modern metallurgy so you didn't have to worry about it blowing up.

The small-ring Mauser is a perfectly safe action, and was purpose designed with "modern metallurgy" capable of withstanding "modern' smokeless cartridges without issue. They were (and are) not at risk of blowing up.

[GJM]

I've never quite understood the appeal of the pre-64 Winchesters and what makes them a "rifleman's rifle". I get that they were made when Winchesters probably got more love and attention at the factory, but the ones I've handled (have never shot one) didn't really stand out over other "good" rifles I've fondled or fired.

Chris

I may be biased as I have many pre-64, model 70 action based hunting rifles with spare actions waiting for future projects. What makes the pre-64 model 70 so desirable to build on, is their feed lips are integral to the action as opposed to being on the magazine box like a modern “pre-64 action,” which makes them feed more reliably, especially with belted calibers. Their triggers are excellent. Their bottom metal is secure. Best of all, the actions are very slick and you can run them aggressively.

My main complaint is the action is a bit heavy, which I have addressed by sometimes eliminating the bottom metal, using fluted barrels and lightweight stocks. My wife, who is left handed, wishes they were available in left hand, and I might wish for a model large enough for .416 Rigby.

I have one pre-64 .375 that has been to Africa three times and harvested lion, leopard, many plains game, and even a few Cape buffalo. It shoots 300 grain Trophy Bonded under an inch at 100 yards, and hasn’t changed zero in 25 years. Once I took it to Africa and got it filthy, pulled it from the stock, cleaned everything, reassembled it and zero didn’t move a click. I have another pre-64 375 H&H that was owned by a missionary in pre-Tanzania and it has a notch in the stock for each elephant he took with it, numbering over 50. My PH in Botswana thought enough of the pre-64 .375 that he carried one as his back-up rifle. My single favorite hunting rifle ever is a pre-64 based .300 WM with a Lilja barrel and Brown Precision stock. It has harvested moose, multiple mule deer and many elk out to 500 yards, with never a wounded animal.

I have hunted in hellacious winter weather with them, and never had an issue, unlike 700 based rifles, where the trigger mechanism froze. As a serious hunting rifle, there is no other action I prefer over a real pre-64 model 70.