...and the sovereignty of the nation...can they be defeated via the courts and the rule of law, or does their (violent) resistance have to be met by greater force than they bring to bear?
Where is the tipping point?
Please discuss...
...and the sovereignty of the nation...can they be defeated via the courts and the rule of law, or does their (violent) resistance have to be met by greater force than they bring to bear?
Where is the tipping point?
Please discuss...
There's nothing civil about this war.
A rebellion is only treason if you lose? (Yeah, yeah, I know, thread meant to be serious. Sorry, couldn't resist.)
At some point "might makes right" always applies.
"Law and order" isn't a thing, its a belief.
If enough people stop believing, it no longer exists.
I think we're already at that point in some isolated areas, and if the State doesn't do something to restore that belief riki-tiki then all bets will be off nationwide very quickly.
"For a moment he felt good about this. A moment or two later he felt bad about feeling good about it. Then he felt good about feeling bad about feeling good about it and, satisfied, drove on into the night."
-- Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy --
You mirror my thoughts, @JodyH (Not surprised.)Originally Posted by JodyH
(Send me your 106 lb kettlebell so I can up my training.)
There's nothing civil about this war.
I think, outside of some places, the majority of Americans still believe in the rule of law. That said, I think Americans generally have an independent streak, and are unlikely to tolerate top down rule by decree.
When the middle gets pushed on by both sides... at some point they push back. It seems like we are already seeing that spirit on display... at least flashes of it. The more it seems like mob rule is the law of the land, the less some folks are going to be restrained in their actions and reactions. Clamping down by "authorities" may make it worse.
It isn't good.
History is not made by majority. In fact, it is usually made by about 3% of most active and passionate folks willing to walk the walk. I am not saying it would be any outcome I'd prefer but that is beyond the point. We can see that a relatively small group of people basically controls the narrative in this country these days. A lot of old school lefties support the radical agenda for various reasons. Some - because of their ignorance, some - because they believe the ends justify the means. Regardless, they are enabling the future, even more radical, shift to the left. Personally, I think we passed the point of no return (Around 2012). Nothing is new in this world though.
Man, I like that one!
May have to try to use it in conversations around the office.
When I first read the title of this thread, I was thinking about the sovereign citizen movement. But I'm not aware of them using violence.
Gettysburg and Appomattox.Where is the tipping point?
Please discuss..
Read: A Savage War of Peace: Algeria 1954-1962 (New York Review Books Classics)
to see how it worked out for the French settlers in Algeria revolting against DeGaulle.
To the question, if the rebelling group is small, the courts and the amount of police force may handle them. With a full scale rebellion, it's civil war.
Is Blue's conceptualization of greater force delineating between police and military? In the USA, we see police, then National Guard and rarely the Military.
In recent times (in my life span in a couple of cases), the latter has been used in civil disturbances in cities, against unions and against states when desegregation schools. The latter is a rebellion against the legitimacy of the law by a sub-federal but governmental entity. The others were not really planned defiance of the government as compared to civil disturbance and protest.
The level of resistance determines the type of force and the consequences - normal legal channels vs. war (which does have more extreme legal consequences depending on how the victor acts).
Look up the West Memphis, Arkansas shooting
“Conspiracy theories are just spoiler alerts these days.”
There is an asymmetric application of law building in the country. Those who reject the authority of police, the rule of laws (non-compliance with the lawful orders of a policeman, rioting, looting), are not prosecuted. The places where this is prevalent have governments run by delusional ideologues who foster this lawlessness. But, if anyone stands to meet force with force, I have not doubt they will meet the full force of the law because their actions will be contrary to the beliefs of the politicians in charge.
I am reminded of a sentence in the book by Fernando Guerre (FerFal) who lived through the Argentinian collapse, blogged about it and then compiled his blog posts into a book. He pointed out, from experience, "The government will not disappear after the SHTF. It may be inefficient, it may be incompetent and unable to protect you, but it will be around to arrest you for breaking the laws the politicians care about."
More and more I feel the law abiding are on our own and the repercussions of our options to deal with violence start at bad and go down from there.
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