History of pistol shooting techniques

[JSGlock34]

Speaking of sights, when did the modern standard of the 3-dot (or similar white dot enhanced) sight start becoming standard?

Good question...I'd speculate that as the various manufacturers submitted their pistols for the JSSAP/XM9 trials in the late 1970s/early 1980s, the white dot sight became more common among service pistols. Trijicon's website states they introduced "the first tritium-illuminated iron sights for handguns" in 1985, and they were adopted by the FBI for issue on the SIG in 1988. I imagine the FBI adoption further opened the door for widespread issue by US law enforcement.

[okie john]

I'd like to see a discussion of who was most influential and how we went from this

to this

No one has mentioned Ed McGivern. Like almost everyone else in the 1930's, he was a revolver guy, but he was a pioneer of speed shooting with sights (especially on aerial targets), combining speed and accuracy, and on courses of fire that tried to reflect actual gunfight conditions. On the other hand, I may be the only guy here old enough to have tried to use some of the stuff in "Fast and Fancy Revolver Shooting" to improve my skills.


Okie John

[JHC]

No one has mentioned Ed McGivern. Like almost everyone else in the 1930's, he was a revolver guy, but he was a pioneer of speed shooting with sights (especially on aerial targets), combining speed and accuracy, and on courses of fire that tried to reflect actual gunfight conditions. On the other hand, I may be the only guy here old enough to have tried to use some of the stuff in "Fast and Fancy Revolver Shooting" to improve my skills.


Okie John

Wow. You GOTTA be old to have played with AERIAL targets. Great catch. The man (McGivern) too fast for a semiauto!

[BaiHu]

No one has mentioned Ed McGivern. Like almost everyone else in the 1930's, he was a revolver guy, but he was a pioneer of speed shooting with sights (especially on aerial targets), combining speed and accuracy, and on courses of fire that tried to reflect actual gunfight conditions. On the other hand, I may be the only guy here old enough to have tried to use some of the stuff in "Fast and Fancy Revolver Shooting" to improve my skills.


Okie John

LOL!

My dad just got me that book last year and I was impressed and disappointed, knowing that my range would shoot me if I started shooting stuff in the air

[NickA]

I'd be curious to know if there's a big difference between what was considered a fast time on, say, the El Presidente, in the 1970's and 1980's, compared to now.
If times are faster now, is it due to evolution of technique, evolution of equipment, or just more people having more time to practice and more opportunities to compete?
<edited for clarity >
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[jetfire]

I vaguely recall reading somewhere that Cooper said a good El Pres would be in the 10 second range with all your hits. Nowadays a good time in Production would be around 6 seconds with all your hits.

[Chris Rhines]

A 6-sec El Prez with no points down is a solid Production GM run. I'd say that anything under 8 seconds is pretty sporty (if you're hitting all A's, that is.)

-C

[JHC]

A 6-sec El Prez with no points down is a solid Production GM run. I'd say that anything under 8 seconds is pretty sporty (if you're hitting all A's, that is.)

-C

I have always assumed the standard was all A's. On a youtube vid from the AMU one of their burners demo's it on GIANT steel targets, doesn't go to slide lock for the reload and shoots it in under 4.0. It was fast and impressive but IMO, not an El Presidente.

[John Hearne]

I see very few folks shoot a proper El Prez. 10 yards, A zone hits, Emergency Reload, targets 3 ft or 3 yds apart.

[jstyer]

I see very few folks shoot a proper El Prez. 10 yards, A zone hits, Emergency Reload, targets 3 ft or 3 yds apart.

Even with the above restrictions... I'd say that 10 seconds is a quite a bit of time.