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Thread: Miami vice card challenge/Mozambique

  1. #1

    Miami vice card challenge/Mozambique

    This drill as a whole has been well covered here.

    If I’m not wrong @MRWhite will be posting this as the drill soon

    My buddy Chris Long and owner of the http://https://www.spas-12.com @cannon762 on IG Is a fantastic shooter (and holder of turbo pin #11)

    He got with Gabe white and some others for this fun take on the failure to stop drill.

    You’ll recall the aiwb draw scene from Miami vice. Fired in a 1.38.



    If you’d like to truly up your game or prove what you’ve got - give it a run.

    http://https://www.triggerprep.com/challenge


    I’m honored to be on the list of challenge winners. For certain this is not an easy drill in the time allotted.

    As I spent time working on it my cold A zone aiwb Hits came down .15 to as fast as .78 and my splits got as fast as .10s with a ported RMR M&p.

    I’m hugely gratefully to have been sort of goaded into trying for it. When Chris told me he had something in the works on this I really though “well if It’s under 5 seconds I can do it “

    For me the secret was as fast a draw as possible and even splits. .99 .15 .16 was my winning run For a 1.30 total.

    Warning up I did the 3 shots as fast as 1.19 but always threw the 2nd A zone up and right.

    Once you get in a rhythm 1.40’ will feel slow and you’ll be able to tell if you’ve got a chance in the first shot.


    Last edited by Duke; 06-24-2020 at 10:20 AM.

  2. #2
    Leopard Printer Mr_White's Avatar
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    Yo! Stand by - it's about to be the Drill of the Week. I don't at all mean not to talk about it in this thread. Just FYI, it's about to be posted as soon as I get it written in probably a few minutes...
    Technical excellence supports tactical preparedness
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  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr_White View Post
    Yo! Stand by - it's about to be the Drill of the Week. I don't at all mean not to talk about it in this thread. Just FYI, it's about to be posted as soon as I get it written in probably a few minutes...
    Thank you.

    Chris told me you were going to Post it just after I made this thread

    Wish I had waited for your lead.


    Thanks again for your effort to put this together. Also I tried it with the latex on like your demo and Jim Z


    It was like I had hamburger helper hands. You guys are mad men!

  4. #4
    Leopard Printer Mr_White's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duke View Post
    Thank you.

    Chris told me you were going to Post it just after I made this thread

    Wish I had waited for your lead.


    Thanks again for your effort to put this together. Also I tried it with the latex on like your demo and Jim Z


    It was like I had hamburger helper hands. You guys are mad men!
    No worries Duke - it will actually work great probably because then people can stick to posting results in the DotW thread and this thread can have all the discussion and comments that will surely go along with the challenge. It'll be fine!

    And I gotta set the record straight - I didn't wear gloves in any of my reenactments of this scene, either the one from some years ago or my entry in the Vice Card Challenge. It was specifically not required in either challenge, so I didn't go there. I felt like it was probably good not to, given that it would involve trying to draw and shoot very quickly. Didn't want any grip disasters...
    Technical excellence supports tactical preparedness
    Lord of the Food Court
    http://www.gabewhitetraining.com

  5. #5
    Leopard Printer Mr_White's Avatar
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    Alright, the Vice Card Challenge for the Drill of the Week is posted here: https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....Card-Challenge

    In that thread, I referenced this one to be used for things other than straightforward drill results. We can have lots of fun in this thread!
    Technical excellence supports tactical preparedness
    Lord of the Food Court
    http://www.gabewhitetraining.com

  6. #6
    Team Garrote '23 backtrail540's Avatar
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    I've already talked to Duke on IG about some tips for a surrender draw, but am curious to see what others (@Mr_White @AsianJedi etc...) have to say as far as what you do differently in a surrender draw vs a hands relaxed draw, if anything.

    I had fallen into a rut/trap/scar in that most starts i've been using a hands relaxed draw that I gamed out and had fallen into a trap of grabbing the hemline of my shirts. After working on a ton of surrender draws today, I am seeing some things not cross over...coming down to the gun as opposed to up and over, where you grab your cover garment seems to be very important, and i've noticed the surrender draw(mine anyway) to be more picky for cover garment choice (thin loose t shirt that I could otherwise work with my gamer hands at sides draw was way more fumble prone from surrender whereas a button up didn't suffer the same issues). Also, for me, surrender seems to be more affected by ride height.

    What nuances have you noticed between a normal hands at side draw vs surrender?
    Last edited by backtrail540; 06-24-2020 at 04:28 PM.
    "...we suffer more in imagination than in reality." Seneca, probably.

  7. #7
    Leopard Printer Mr_White's Avatar
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    The way I do it with a hands up start is to bring my big, flat, open support hand to my diaphragm area, like slapping myself, and close my hand so it bunches the garment, lifting it upward and clearing the gun, and the strong hand hits master grip right after that. Both hands move at the same time. It is the shorter path of the support hand that lets it clear the garment before the strong hand reaches the grip.

    It is somewhat dependent on garment material and length. Too slippery or too long may not work well.

    The reason I do it that way is that I tend to short-stroke the reach to the hemline with a hands up start and this way essentially eliminates that error. Thus, I divide my freestyle AIWB draws by whether the hands start below or above the hemline.

    You may also have to experiment with strong hand path to gun in order to find a grip consistent with what you get with a hands down start.

    (ETA: There's more shirt lifting than I realized, in addition to the hand bunching.)

    Front views from an older video:

    Last edited by Mr_White; 06-24-2020 at 08:18 PM.
    Technical excellence supports tactical preparedness
    Lord of the Food Court
    http://www.gabewhitetraining.com

  8. #8
    I don’t feel as though I can add any value to what Gabe said.


    Body mechanics and physical limitations are a factor though.

    From some angle I can look as though I’m failing to meet the criteria of “surrender” as far as an agree upon starting position.

    “Hand at or above nipple. Palms facing target “

    I have low nipples (tmi) long arms, rounded posture and repaired carpel/limited mobility of my right wrist. Smooth draw requires a bit of hip shimmy also to sure up my grip angle

    For me to be in a true hands up surrender I’ve got to had my hands even with my shoulders.

    Guess I need my hands up over my face like Gabe’s example
    Last edited by Duke; 06-24-2020 at 08:57 PM.

  9. #9
    This will prove most challenging as I carry at the 4 o'clock and when trying it dry, it was painfully obvious that the hands up start is going to add to my struggles.

    About the fastest I've ever ran a first shot is 1.07-1.09 range with a good hit.

    Is AIWB and a 1.00 flat first shot pretty much a "must have" to run this in that time? Doubtful I'll ever come close to it but just wondering how much time/ammo I should invest in it.

    I'm thinking for me 1.5 is a more realistic goal. Not to video....but more just a drill to add to the fun.

    Regards.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by lwt16 View Post
    This will prove most challenging as I carry at the 4 o'clock and when trying it dry, it was painfully obvious that the hands up start is going to add to my struggles.

    About the fastest I've ever ran a first shot is 1.07-1.09 range with a good hit.

    Is AIWB and a 1.00 flat first shot pretty much a "must have" to run this in that time? Doubtful I'll ever come close to it but just wondering how much time/ammo I should invest in it.

    I'm thinking for me 1.5 is a more realistic goal. Not to video....but more just a drill to add to the fun.

    Regards.
    1.07 first hit will work but you’ve got to make up the time in splits - with accuracy - which will be hard

    Ideally is. .90 .20 .20 so you don’t outrun the sights/dot


    A better plan is get the best hits you can and then work the speed.

    At 1.42-1.50 I can almost get the 2 a zones to touch. At 1.30 I have to use the whole A zone

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    Last edited by Duke; 06-25-2020 at 07:33 AM.

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