I have a thermal optic, haven’t seen any reptiles with it, mostly rodents, birds and coyotes. Next time I see one, I’ll try and grab it to see how well it picks them up.Originally Posted by RevolverRob
Since this is GD. Anyone who is running NODs and/or thermal - have you spotted any reptiles while out at night? Snakes, lizards, frogs?
The field herpetologist in me is wondering if I can find a way to justify NODs in my next grant budget.
It must be a bit of a hurdle for a lot of people buying them if TNVC went through the trouble of setting up a financing program. Besides, isn't $3k just the cost of admission? Seems like guys spend as much or more on helmets, mounts, illuminators/aiming devices, and all the other accessories that seem to be mandatory for doing anything beyond sitting still and looking around. Not to mention the time and expense required to get beyond basic proficiency.
You make a good point about priorities. People certainly spend stupid amounts of money on less useful things or outright harmful vices. My question, though, is should NVDs be prioritized over hardware/software that prepares you for events that are 10x-1000x more likely than needing to shoot and maneuver outside at night?
I suppose there are always going to be consumers that will want something now and pay later. I see that even with TV sets and furniture. PVS-14's with Gen 2 Photonis tubes can be found as low as $2300 new if you shop around. If you are careful and really watch ebay closely you can even get into a used unit for under $1500 but you have to know what to look for and what questions to ask concerning the condition of a used NVD.
You can pay a lot or a little for helmets, mounts, and accessories. A Pro-Tec bump helmet and used PVS-14 rhino mount and J-arm shouldn't set you back more than $200. My bump helmet doesn't get used anymore. I replaced it with a $75 Crye Night Cap. It works just as well as the helmet but can fit in a cargo pocket. Surefire IR WML's are $300 on up but an IR filter for a Streamlight WML is under $40. IR laser designators can get expensive but the Russian PERST 1 and PERST 4 look like inexpensive alternatives that are built like tanks.
Being able to sit still and see almost everything around you in darkness with passive means can be quite useful. It's dark about half the time and most of the time when these scenarios that we prepare for tend to occur so having that tool may come into play more that you imagine. I can't really speak to the training aspect of it. It's all seems pretty intuitive to me but the government did provide my initial training on it many years ago so I am use to it.
My tinnitus says suppressors are not a LARP purchase.
In a TEOTWAKI scenario a suppressor has the advantage of helping mask your location when shooting regardless of lighting conditions. Nor does it require batteries or a complex and perishable skill set and they are cheaper than NODS.
NODS are fun, and as fellow PVS7 user, in the land of the blind men, the one eyed man is king, but there is a learning curve and there are limitations to single tube NODS.
Unless you happen to be that one eyed man...
I think this is it exactly. I wouldn't have much use for them in town. At my cabin where there is often no light at all, they were amazing.
This is a thread where I built a boat I designed and which I very occasionally update with accounts of using it, which is really fun as long as I'm not driving over logs and blowing up the outboard.
https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....ilding-a-skiff
I can't imagine a scenario where I would need night vision. I trained with them in the Army for driving, booby traps/obstacles, and urban combat and like others have mentioned, they have weaknesses as well. I can't imagine a scenario that doesn't involve me being a feral raider. If it's too dark for me to see, it's probably too dark for me to be targeted as well. I'm unlikely to be going on the offensive. I'm unlikely to have a squad.
Of course I don't have a truck gun, either, and think a pre-runner bumper might be a better investment then either NVGs or a truck gun so what do I know.
Sorta around sometimes for some of your shitty mod needs.
Thanks for the detailed reply! I keep an eye on the ARF EE, and there are definitely some deals to be had on used tubes.
The ability to passively observe what's out there in the dark does interest me, which is why I've toyed with the idea of getting something like a FLIR Scout TK monocular just to dip my toes in the water. Do you have any thoughts about Sionyx gear? I know it's a different kind of technology that I've heard is less suited for outdoor navigation/run and gun type stuff, but it seems like it could be the ticket for that stationary observation role.
I have had an ITT 6015 monocular for 20+ years and found basically no need for them in urban policing outside of surprisingly rare very low light surveillance. Even then it was just to verify no movement in the deep shadows and of questionable need.
However, I have found them to be incredibly useful when on nature walks at night just to see around and a guaranteed way to see a falling star within a couple minutes from my porch. They are also fun during blackouts. I have a helmet mount and IR laser as well but opportunity and training time is hard to find, although my friends do post fun looking night shoot competition pics. I have driven dark dirt roads at night, slowly, and that is fun, especially for the passengers!
Given my use I see them more as an additional observational tool like binoculars, but needed in far fewer situations. I like having them around like a fire extinguisher or emergency cash in my bag but I would agree that proficiency in the tactical basics and some realistic mindset training is a far, far, better use of limited funds.
That said I'll probably upgrade to dual tube full color when they get smaller and lighter!
Dennis.
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I have never been a fan of "Digital" night vision or night vision that requires an active IR light source to be effective at moderate distances. The FLIR 240 Scout can be found on ebay pretty regularly sub $800 in like new condition, just a little more than the price of a new Scout TK. I used one for a couple years and found them to have some pretty decent features. Detection and recognition range will be about 3X that of the Scout TK. I am currently using a Pulsar HD 50S thermal which was quite a step up from the FLIR 240 and 320 but there are better performing units available now, but at a significant price.
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