I'm knocking my LEOSA requal out at X-CAL in Loudon in December. At least it's another option for us here in NOVA.
I'm knocking my LEOSA requal out at X-CAL in Loudon in December. At least it's another option for us here in NOVA.
XCAL? How bougie of you.Originally Posted by Kyle Reese
Do you even own clothes expensive enough to walk in there?
"Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer
Hmmm. Just looked at their website. I may have to run up there and check that place out.
The NRA doesn't charge for LEOSA quals and X-CAL lists $60 as the price. NRA doesn't play the game of specifying which handgun you qualed with - no revolver/pistol differentiation and certainly no specification of a particular model of semi-auto. Those are BS games I have heard of various private entities playing.
Aside from a nice menu, how is X-CAL on LEOSA? It's only about a 20 minute drive from the NRA range.
You are making assumptions that are not necessarily correct.
For example, in NC if you are not qualified by the agency which you retired from, you must qualify either with a certified law enforcement agency recognized by the state or a private trainer who is certified to qualify active law enforcement officers. If you qualify, as I did, with the local sheriff's office, then by state regulation, you are only LEOSA certified for the particular firearm or firearms you qualified with. (The qualification is also good for any other equivalent models...such as any Glock 26 if you qualified with a 26. They do not record the serial number.)
So, even if I went to a certified NRA instructor to qualify in NC, the same limitations would apply. The NRA does not get a pass which enables them to circumvent how the state administers LEOSA.
There's nothing civil about this war.
There is certainly a good amount of debate around LEOSA. Much of which hasn't been resolved by lawsuit/failed prosecutions because retired cops don't generally go around doing retarded things that would get some of this stuff resolved.
There is a certain amount of ass-covering and unnecessary hand-wringing over LEOSA.
LEOSA is a federal law starting with "Notwithstanding any other provision of the law of any State or any political subdivision thereof." Meaning the state doesn't get a whole lot of say on the matter. The extent to which the state is allowed to have a say is establishing the standard that needs to be met, i.e. the course of fire and score required. They don't get any say in delineating what firearm you are qualified to carry beyond handgun, rifle, shotgun.
LEOSA defines handgun as a firearm which has a short stock and is designed to be held and fired by the use of a single hand. Which means if you qualify on a Glock 17 you can carry anything from an LCR to a Desert Eagle.
It doesn't surprise me that a county sheriff would defer to his state's law in this situation. But he shouldn't. There's nothing you can really do about it though. This is why it's nice to qual at the NRA. They aren't usurping how the state administers LEOSA. Their instructors qualify under VA law and they are complying exactly with the federal law as written. Which doesn't require a specification beyond "handgun" and state law can't change that. Unfortunately LEOSA is one of those things where you just have to take what you can find.
I worry, probably needlessly, that if I had to carry a qual card that said a particular model of gun that in some weird situation I might get jammed up by some cop that wasn't familiar with LEOSA and took issue with my carrying a G43 when my card said G17. Having a card that says I've "met the standards for firearms qualification" with no further specification seems to further minimize that unlikely possibility.
I don't generally have a bone to pick with the local sheriffs that are qualing retired guys outside their agencies. I kind of feel like they are going out of their way to be accommodating. What I have an issue with are the asshole private instructors who meet their state's requirement to qual LEOs and then charge guys $50 for each weapon they want to carry, and from what I've heard sometimes a separate qual for each gun, to include serial number not just model number.
I don't know if you are just unwilling to understand or simply don't because I am doing a piss poor job of it.
...Leaving the sheriff entirely out of the equation...
If I went to qualify with a certified instructor...NRA, private or otherwise...who is certified in the state of NC to administer qualifications to law enforcement...the LEOSA certification issued by the state DOJ would still only list the model of handgun(s) used during the qualification.
VA is not NC...and the federal law provides for following the requirements of the state when the qualification is not administered by the agency the LEO retired from.
In NC, the state law which is followed is NC's. And any NRA instructor, and I know some of them, is bound to follow those same rules as I have laid out. It's got nothing to do with the sheriff.
Here is the NC LEOSA site:
https://ncdoj.gov/law-enforcement-tr...certification/
A retired officer residing in North Carolina may meet the State’s standards in one of two ways, as follows:
The retired officer may qualify with the agency from which he/she retired. Under this scenario, the agency is responsible for providing documentation to the retired officer to verify their completion of the annual in-service firearms training and qualification requirements. No documentation would have to be submitted to the Criminal Justice Standards Commission by the agency or the officer; or,
The retired officer may go to a Commission certified law enforcement Specialized Firearms Instructor and complete the training and qualification and then apply to the Criminal Justice Standards Commission for certification under the new Retired Law Enforcement Officers Firearms Qualification Certification Program.
Specific information explaining the requirements for participating in this program are at the following links:
the Administrative Rules 9H .0101 – .0105, which have been adopted by the Commission;
the Frequently Asked Questions [FAQs] adopted for the program;
the Application Form (F-9R) to be used to apply to the Commission, and
the CCH Carry Guidelines addressing restrictions on carrying concealed firearms by active and retired law enforcement officers and CCH permit holders.
I fully understand what the federal law requires and states...and that a court might agree that I could carry any pistol based upon my qualification with any given handgun with whichever entity I did so with...but that is not what we are discussing here. It's not about whether I could challenge my right to carry a G19 when I qualified with a G26...but what NC requires in order to receive LEOSA certification if you do not qualify with your agency.
Period.
Let's please not muddy up my thread further. Feel free to start one of your own.
Last edited by blues; 10-25-2023 at 09:13 AM.
There's nothing civil about this war.
I used to shoot my LEOSA quals at Elite, and this will be my first foray into a LEOSA qual at X-Cal. I'll post up my impressions in a separate thread after I qual in December.
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