Help Newb to Defend Home against the Horde

[jayc]

I originally posted this story in a different forum, but a helpful member referred me here to get more helpful advice.

A few days ago, my city was ravaged by looters. My apartment is 2 miles from the target shopping area so I thought I was safe. Then the looters started moving closer and closer. They attempted to hit a few residences. The residents called 911 but were told, "Sorry, you're on your own. The police are occupied." Thank goodness the looters were looking for quick crash and grab because the residents defended their homes and the looters moved on to the next target.
Once we learned the police wouldn't help, we were all trying to come up with weapons to defend ourselves. Some suggestions included spray sunscreen, hairspray and a lighter, and a hammer. I'll give you a few minutes to finish laughing. We were woefully unprepared.

After a few days, I emerged from my apartment and ran into a neighbor who was inspecting our rear security gate. The looters tried to break it down and the gate was busted. The door held, but it was close.
I do not own any firearms. Neither do my neighbors. I need to prepare my family if this ever happens again.

I live in the Los Angeles county area. I need help selecting some guns.

Question:
Please recommend a firearm, gear, and accessories that I can legally obtain in CA to ward off the horde. Think protection against the zombie apocalypse. If the looters turn into rioters, I don't want to be stuck with nothing but spray suncreen.

Assume no police protection is coming in your replies.

I found a great training facility with ex-special forces as instructors. I plan to take many classes there so I don't end up as a fool hurting myself or my family.

[Nephrology]

Hi jayc,

Firstly, welcome to the forum. We're glad you're here, and our community is more than happy to help you get answers to your questions.

The first thing to know is that California has very restrictive gun control laws. I am sorry if this is news to you, but it will more than likely be something of an obstacle in your quest to exercise your 2nd amendment rights. I do not live in CA, nor have I ever, so I will defer to members from those states on how to navigate the law. Wikipedia has a reasonable summary of the laws in your state if you haven't taken a look already.

It seems like you will need a Firearms Safety Certificate before you can buy a gun. I would work on finding a class in order to obtain your certificate ASAP as step number one.

Once you have a firearms safety certificate, it looks like you should be able to buy a long arm (i.e., a rifle or a shotgun) but not a handgun. Because time seems to a factor, I would start with a longarm.

While in most states an AR-15 would be the answer to what you are looking for, they are heavily neutered in order to comply with CA law, and may be less useful than they could be in other states. I would instead suggest you look at a quality 12 gauge shotgun, ideally a semi-automatic such as the Benelli M2 or the Beretta 1301 Tactical. We have whole subforums dedicated to the rifle and the shotgun, and I encourage you to peruse them while you wait for your class. Do you have a sense of what your budget for this gun might be? It would help us find the right choice for you.

There may be nuances in the law that I am not aware of, so hopefully some of our CA members (like @0ddl0t, @Suvorov) can weigh in.

Welcome to the forum! Please do not hesitate to ask questions in any of the sub-forums or threads that are germane to your interests - we are a friendly bunch and will do what we can to help you out.

edit:

I found a great training facility with ex-special forces as instructors. I plan to take many classes there so I don't end up as a fool hurting myself or my family.

This is a great idea and I strongly encourage you to follow through. We have a very active training community here that can help you vet and/or locate alternative instruction if that becomes necessary, but it sounds like you have a good place to start.

[willie]

I originally posted this story in a different forum, but a helpful member referred me here to get more helpful advice.

A few days ago, my city was ravaged by looters. My apartment is 2 miles from the target shopping area so I thought I was safe. Then the looters started moving closer and closer. They attempted to hit a few residences. The residents called 911 but were told, "Sorry, you're on your own. The police are occupied." Thank goodness the looters were looking for quick crash and grab because the residents defended their homes and the looters moved on to the next target.
Once we learned the police wouldn't help, we were all trying to come up with weapons to defend ourselves. Some suggestions included spray sunscreen, hairspray and a lighter, and a hammer. I'll give you a few minutes to finish laughing. We were woefully unprepared.

After a few days, I emerged from my apartment and ran into a neighbor who was inspecting our rear security gate. The looters tried to break it down and the gate was busted. The door held, but it was close.
I do not own any firearms. Neither do my neighbors. I need to prepare my family if this ever happens again.

I live in the Los Angeles county area. I need help selecting some guns.

Question:
Please recommend a firearm, gear, and accessories that I can legally obtain in CA to ward off the horde. Think protection against the zombie apocalypse. If the looters turn into rioters, I don't want to be stuck with nothing but spray suncreen.

Assume no police protection is coming in your replies.

I found a great training facility with ex-special forces as instructors. I plan to take many classes there so I don't end up as a fool hurting myself or my family.

Do you have pepper spray? Golf clubs? Bats? Fire extinguishers? Sling shots? Spears? Fire crackers? At this point you are not likely to find guns for sale. You might put up signs that proclaim.

[Cookie Monster]

Question:
Please recommend a firearm, gear, and accessories that I can legally obtain in CA to ward off the horde. Think protection against the zombie apocalypse. If the looters turn into rioters, I don't want to be stuck with nothing but spray sunscreen.

Assume no police protection is coming in your replies.

I found a great training facility with ex-special forces as instructors. I plan to take many classes there so I don't end up as a fool hurting myself or my family.

I am sorry you had to go through that but it shows us where we need to build ourselves as people.

As Neph says, start with a long gun and a way to secure it (I think that is Cali law but it's just good practice, I use V-Line safes for quick access stuff). When I lived in California (left in 2012), I had lever action rifles for the kind of situation you described but they are often difficult to mount a light to. I would lean towards a proven semi-auto shotgun or a lever gun.

Even just getting some basic NRA certified instructor training at first. Special Forces dudes are great but sometimes don't get a civilian context as well as other trainers.

I think the rest of my brothers here at PF will cover more gun stuff but I would have you think about:

• Fire Extinguishers
• Items used to barricade apartment door - wedges or 2x4's and some screws
• A simple go bag of water, some food, external battery for phone, cash, and comfort items to grab and get in the car and leave
• A small medical bag to manage larger issues, if police can't come, medics probably aren't coming

I think there could be situations where you appropriately point a long gun and folks get the idea and leave but also situations where you could just leave instead of having to shoot six drunk people in masks.

I live rural now, If I call 911 right now, I would think 45 minute to 1 hour 15 for law enforcement or medical response. Longer during night time hours. I am prepared to cover what is needed to be covered.

[RJ]

Welcome jayc. This is a good place to ask for advice. I'm not the best to provide answers for Cali or SoCal, since I live in FL. The guys above have good suggestions. I would follow up on those.

Only suggestion I could think of was to increase your situational awareness buy perhaps adding some battery powered, motion sensor lights. Something like these (there are a lot of options, this is just an example):

https://www.amazon.com/HONWELL-Opera...400181&sr=8-17

As you stated, the Police are pretty occupied these days, and so many of us are on our own. Good luck and I hope you and your family are safe in these uncertain times.

[Duelist]

When I lived in Cali, you didn’t have to have the safety class yet, but did have to wait two weeks (10 business days) to pick up your new pistol, even if you were trading one in to get it.

I second the notion to get the required gun safety class taken care of. Meanwhile, buy a couple of baseball bats and some pepper spray, and learn to use them.

Once you have the safety class, you have several things to be concerned about: learning to use a gun, learning when to use it and when not to, and preparing yourself mentally to make those decisions.

These are things that, if you take them seriously, are an investment of time and energy. Money, as well, though that varies. You will be a somewhat different person, I think, when you have gone through this process.

[RJ]

Did a quick check around of web sources for Castle Doctrine. Obviously this is not definitive, but wiki at least indicates there is no duty to retreat, summarizing it as:

"California never requires a duty to retreat whether in your own home or not. The state acknowledges a legal presumption that an intruder poses a deadly threat if in your own home or property that is owned and controlled by yourself. "

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_la...ate#California

Probably best to defer to the Cali folks here. Cali gun laws seem to be changing at a rapid pace, and there may be differences between State law and specific counties (thinking of SF in this case, for example).

[Blades]

I bet there are wasp nests around your apartment building. Maybe get some wasp spray while you wait on something more potent. It's better than nothing.

[Malamute]

Check local laws, but the large pepper spray canisters that you want for hiking in areas with wild animals may also be handy in case of situations you described. Smaller versions you can have on you and your living partners can also be useful tools.

A very powerful flashlight can be useful at night to gain a small window of movement when someone is momentarily blinded by the bright light, and wont raise any eyebrows. Good and very powerful lights are very small and reasonably affordable, making them simple to carry at all times. Have spare batteries.

As was mentioned, ways to help secure your doors might be good. Getting some of the metal brackets that utilize 2x4s as door crossbar blocks may be good to have on hand. If you own a quality screw gun (cordless drill) And a quantity of 3 or 4" gold torx or star drive screws, one can install the brace hardware pretty quickly if needed. become familiar with residential framing practices so you have a clue where to screw into something secure. Theres usually a gap of a half inch between the thin flimsy door jambs and the framing, then 3" worth of studs on each side of the door. A pair of such crossbars on a door may be adequate, one high, one low, dividing the door into thirds is what id suggest.


Someone makes a kit, but you can buy the individual parts yourself at a hardware store or Home Depot and no doubt save money (remember they cut lumber to length for free). This is the idea though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tr0N3gmtQTo

Also look into how to replace all the cheap small screws in your door latch hardware and hinges with 3" black drywall or gold torx screws, it helps repel kick-ins. Both are hardened. Dont over torque the screws, most of the time the jambs arent shimmed well under the hardware and you can distort the jamb, just seat them so the hardware stays in place. Do a couple of the hinge screws into the door with 3"ers and use about 2" screws on the door locking bolts and deadbolts (into the door itself), longer ones right there may interefe with operation of the locking and knob hardware. If you own your place, or if your landlord doesnt mind, upgrading your door to a heavier one may be worthwhile to you. You should be able to swap out the screws without problem with the landlord. If they ask.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOvjuRVZOQ4

Have spare driver tips for your screw gun and screws of choice, dropping one at an inopportune moment may be embarrassing. Buy quality tips, and magnetic tip holders, it helps keep from dropping screws when working and you can reach with the tip and pick up screws when you drop them.

You can get a film that applies to glass that reduces breakage greatly. Theres been some news video of people trying to break windows and nothing happening, or not shattering and falling out, thats likely the type film treatment Im talking about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZy4DJHM_fs

[rv245]

Invest in a good reasonably price security system. We have a second home and have cameras. I know doesn't help when I'm down here up and not up there, but you can see what's going on and report it if necessary. The other day, I was watching the pest control guy spray the yard for sketters, getting off subject here.....lol Point is if you can see the action happening outside before it goes down, you can plan and prepare ahead of time. Don't know your layout,but you might get by with just a couple cameras or 4 for each corner. We have 5, 3 outside, 1 in the house cover both entrances , and 1 in the garage, again coming both entrances. We have them set for motion and audio pickup.