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Thread: No more Gen 1-4 Reduced Pre-Travel SCDs?

  1. #1
    Member Xhado's Avatar
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    No more Gen 1-4 Reduced Pre-Travel SCDs?

    I was about to list an old reduce pre-travel SCD that I no longer need and when I was trying to lookup what current retail is I noticed that they are no longer sold.

    What was the reason for removing them from the lineup?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xhado View Post
    I was about to list an old reduce pre-travel SCD that I no longer need and when I was trying to lookup what current retail is I noticed that they are no longer sold.

    What was the reason for removing them from the lineup?
    According to @Tom_Jones, the reduced pretravel triggers and the principles behind production of the SCD are antithetical, and continuing to produce SCDs for them doesnít make sense.

    I agree with those sentiments.

  3. #3
    Supporting Business taudevgroup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xhado View Post
    What was the reason for removing them from the lineup?
    Duelist basically covered it, but here is the blurb I usually send in response to this query:

    Quote Originally Posted by taudevgroup
    We have chosen to no longer support aftermarket triggers that reduce so-called ďpre-travelĒ. The reason being that all travel in a Glock trigger is intentional and functional. A reduced pre-travel trigger simply starts with the trigger pre-pulled and the SCD is designed to detect and prevent unintentional trigger movement during holstering. By modifying an SCD to support these aftermarket triggers the ďsafety marginĒ is reduced since the trigger, and therefore the SCD, moves less before the striker is released. Fundamentally, so-called reduced pre-travel triggers are devices that I cannot in good conscience support. I know many people like them, and if they provide the desired trigger characteristics for those people they should continue to use them ó I just donít wish for my product to be used in conjunction with them. In the end, the design goals of the two products are antithetical.
    More and more aftermarket trigger makers seem to be reducing pre-travel more and more -- well past the point I consider safe. How much of this is in response to actual informed consumer demand and how much is do to "influencers" or just an irrational desire to give a Glock a "1911 trigger" despite the utter inappropriateness of such an endeavor, I'll never know. However, I decided that enough is enough and neither myself or my company is going to play even a trivial role in encouraging or advocating it. Additionally, I invested more money into buying aftermarket triggers than I've made in profit from reduced pre-travel compatible SCD sales -- and at the rate the these triggers are hitting the market it's an almost certainty that I never would (assuming I continued to test for acceptability).

    The good news is that if people want triggers like that, I'm not going to attempt to talk them out of it. Buy what you want and that delivers the performance and features that you need. No one will ever get a SCD hard-sell from me.

    Maybe some day we'll offer an aftermarket trigger that offers things like a smooth/flat trigger face and improved trigger safety tab feel (and looks bitchin' on Instagram) -- without removing the intentional and functional pre-travel that is an integral part of the Glock Safe Action trigger system.

  4. #4
    Site Supporter LOKNLOD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by taudevgroup View Post
    Duelist basically covered it, but here is the blurb I usually send in response to this query:



    More and more aftermarket trigger makers seem to be reducing pre-travel more and more -- well past the point I consider safe. How much of this is in response to actual informed consumer demand and how much is do to "influencers" or just an irrational desire to give a Glock a "1911 trigger" despite the utter inappropriateness of such an endeavor, I'll never know. However, I decided that enough is enough and neither myself or my company is going to play even a trivial role in encouraging or advocating it. Additionally, I invested more money into buying aftermarket triggers than I've made in profit from reduced pre-travel compatible SCD sales -- and at the rate the these triggers are hitting the market it's an almost certainty that I never would (assuming I continued to test for acceptability).

    The good news is that if people want triggers like that, I'm not going to attempt to talk them out of it. Buy what you want and that delivers the performance and features that you need. No one will ever get a SCD hard-sell from me.

    Maybe some day we'll offer an aftermarket trigger that offers things like a smooth/flat trigger face and improved trigger safety tab feel (and looks bitchin' on Instagram) -- without removing the intentional and functional pre-travel that is an integral part of the Glock Safe Action trigger system.
    ETA: bad info below, sorry - just in case this comes up in somebody's search some day.

    IIRC putting a standard SCD on a Glock with a reduced pre-travel trigger just results in an SCD that doesn't quite sit flush with the back of the slide when fully depressed. Maybe that's an "outside the intended usage" installation and you'd recommend against it? I've played with it on an Overwatch trigger (before the purposely reduced travel version came about) and didn't find any adverse effects.
    Last edited by LOKNLOD; 05-30-2020 at 03:11 PM.
    --Josh

  5. #5
    Supporting Business taudevgroup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LOKNLOD View Post
    Tom,
    IIRC putting a standard SCD on a Glock with a reduced pre-travel trigger just results in an SCD that doesn't quite sit flush with the back of the slide when fully depressed. Maybe that's an "outside the intended usage" installation and you'd recommend against it? I've played with it on an Overwatch trigger (before the purposely reduced travel version came about) and didn't find any adverse effects.
    I'll try to write more about this (again -- I've done it literally hundreds of times in the past few years) later, but the SCD should NOT be used with any trigger that reduces pre-travel compared to the stock trigger. The old reduced pre-travel trigger was specifically designed to work with the triggers from Overwatch because using the non-reduced pre-travel version with it was outside the scope of the design of the original.

    ETA: If my stance on this leads to people deciding to not buy my products, or support my company, I'm 100% OK with that.

  6. #6
    Site Supporter LOKNLOD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by taudevgroup View Post
    I'll try to write more about this (again -- I've done it literally hundreds of times in the past few years) later, but the SCD should NOT be used with any trigger that reduces pre-travel compared to the stock trigger. The old reduced pre-travel trigger was specifically designed to work with the triggers from Overwatch because using the non-reduced pre-travel version with it was outside the scope of the design of the original.

    ETA: If my stance on this leads to people deciding to not buy my products, or support my company, I'm 100% OK with that.
    My bad. Didnít mean to spread bad info. I clearly mis-remembered a chunk of those previous discussions (which, thinking back, maybe were pre-reduced-pre-travel development, actually, as I wasn't paying much attention when the actual reduced units rolled around).
    --Josh

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    I may be weird, but I would like more pre-travel, and a commensurate increase in SCD movement.

  8. #8
    Site Supporter dontshakepandas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark D View Post
    I may be weird, but I would like more pre-travel, and a commensurate increase in SCD movement.
    Nope, not weird. Exactly why I just switched from Glock to a P30 LEM.

    I had Overwatch poly triggers on 3 Glocks and none removed enough pre-travel to cause compatibility issues with the standard SCD, but I understand it may on some guns just due to tolerances.

  9. #9
    Supporting Business taudevgroup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dontshakepandas View Post
    I had Overwatch poly triggers on 3 Glocks and none removed enough pre-travel to cause compatibility issues with the standard SCD, but I understand it may on some guns just due to tolerances.
    Iím not calling you a liar, but I doubt it ó at least a little bit. The SCD is designed to not touch the striker when the trigger is fully forward and at rest. By design, it nominally sits 0.015Ē from the rear face of the striker (this is an intentional and important part of the design). The triggers from Overwatch, based upon all the triggers I bought and tried/measured in a few dozen different guns, nominally moves the striker back from the stock starting position (again when the trigger is fully forward and at rest) by 0.040Ē. In fact, the reduced pre-travel variant of the SCD was specifically designed around the Overwatch Precision triggers.

    Admittedly, I havenít tested all that many OWP poly triggers (compared to their aluminum ones), but the ones I did test removed approximately the same amount of pre-travel and I had to modify them to restore the full amount of stock pre-travel. Itís certainly possible they changed something since (or before) I purchased mine. In fact, one of the reasons I stopped supporting aftermarket triggers that reduced pre-travel is that it seemed like the assorted trigger makers kept changing things (either the actual product or the verbiage on their websites describing the triggers) and it basically impossible to provide meaningful guidance to customers. There no such problem with OEM parts.

  10. #10
    Site Supporter dontshakepandas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by taudevgroup View Post
    Iím not calling you a liar, but I doubt it ó at least a little bit. The SCD is designed to not touch the striker when the trigger is fully forward and at rest. By design, it nominally sits 0.015Ē from the rear face of the striker (this is an intentional and important part of the design). The triggers from Overwatch, based upon all the triggers I bought and tried/measured in a few dozen different guns, nominally moves the striker back from the stock starting position (again when the trigger is fully forward and at rest) by 0.040Ē. In fact, the reduced pre-travel variant of the SCD was specifically designed around the Overwatch Precision triggers.

    Admittedly, I havenít tested all that many OWP poly triggers (compared to their aluminum ones), but the ones I did test removed approximately the same amount of pre-travel and I had to modify them to restore the full amount of stock pre-travel. Itís certainly possible they changed something since (or before) I purchased mine. In fact, one of the reasons I stopped supporting aftermarket triggers that reduced pre-travel is that it seemed like the assorted trigger makers kept changing things (either the actual product or the verbiage on their websites describing the triggers) and it basically impossible to provide meaningful guidance to customers. There no such problem with OEM parts.
    I donít have the guns in question any longer, but when I bought the poly triggers the #1 criteria for keeping it was that the SCD would lay completely flat and that I could get at least a tiny bit of trigger travel without visible movement. I was prepared to modify the trigger shot to accomplish that if necessary, but didnít have to.

    This was on 2 Gen 5 19s and a 48. I never took any measurements, and it did feel like their was slightly more movement on the stock trigger before the SCD would move, but I felt comfortable enough with it since the difference was very small and the stock trigger would cause blisters on my finger.

    I had one of their aluminum triggers on the same gun/SCD previously and with that installed the SCD would not lay flat (not even close) so I imagine you are right variance in their products across models and from unit to unit and I just got lucky with my 3 samples.

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