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Thread: New York man arrested for using unlicensed gun to shoot robber . . .

  1. #1

    New York man arrested for using unlicensed gun to shoot robber . . .

    A Brooklyn, New York, grocery store was reportedly arrested after using an unlicensed gun to shoot an alleged knife-wielding robbery suspect Monday night.

    CBS New York reports that the incident occurred at the Rose Family Grocery Store just after 11 p.m. The suspect, Edwin Candelario, was allegedly wielding a knife and was shot multiple times by the clerk.

    Candelario was rushed to a hospital and pronounced dead.

    ABC 7 reports that the clerk, an unidentified 34-year-old male, was arrested because he “was not licensed to have the gun.

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Duces Tecum View Post
    A Brooklyn, New York, grocery store was reportedly arrested after using an unlicensed gun to shoot an alleged knife-wielding robbery suspect Monday night.

    CBS New York reports that the incident occurred at the Rose Family Grocery Store just after 11 p.m. The suspect, Edwin Candelario, was allegedly wielding a knife and was shot multiple times by the clerk.

    Candelario was rushed to a hospital and pronounced dead.

    ABC 7 reports that the clerk, an unidentified 34-year-old male, was arrested because he “was not licensed to have the gun.
    F@*k New York.

    Wonder if the NRA will be willing to help him out with the coming court battle?

  3. #3
    Modding this sack of shit BehindBlueI's's Avatar
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    Our prosecutor's office has historically been *very* hesitant to file "no license to carry" and "felon in possession" (absent serious violent felon status) for most situations mirroring that. One, we want the victim's cooperation against the "real criminal" and gets the "not in the best interest of justice" turn-down*. Two, jury nullification concerns as local juries don't like it.

    *Preemptively, I get the "real criminal" is dead here and not subject to prosecution, just talking in general.
    Sorta around sometimes for some of your shitty mod needs.

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    Good. Maybe we can get a supreme court ruling in our favor over this.

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    Member TGS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BehindBlueI's View Post
    Our prosecutor's office has historically been *very* hesitant to file "no license to carry" and "felon in possession" (absent serious violent felon status) for most situations mirroring that. One, we want the victim's cooperation against the "real criminal" and gets the "not in the best interest of justice" turn-down*. Two, jury nullification concerns as local juries don't like it.

    *Preemptively, I get the "real criminal" is dead here and not subject to prosecution, just talking in general.
    It sounds like your DA is viewing such situations with the "competing harms" concept.

    ...but, would it really be applicable here? Doesn't that idea hinge on the concept that you gained access to the firearm in-extremis (such as a felon justifiably shooting someone using a friend's gun, or someone without a gun license grabbing a downed officer's gun to shoot a killer), and not applicable to someone who was breaking the law before the need arose?

    Or, is what you're talking about a different practice altogether?

    @LockedBreech @ssb what about your areas?
    "Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer

  6. #6
    Modding this sack of shit BehindBlueI's's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TGS View Post
    It sounds like your DA is viewing such situations with the "competing harms" concept.

    ...but, would it really be applicable here? Doesn't that idea hinge on the concept that you gained access to the firearm in-extremis (such as a felon justifiably shooting someone using a friend's gun, or someone without a gun license grabbing someone else's gun to shoot a killer), and not applicable to someone who was breaking the law before the need arose?

    Or, is what you're talking about a different practice altogether?

    @LockedBreech @ssb what about your areas?
    What you're describing in the example is a necessity defense. That's an actually-in-the-book legal defense. You broke the law but you did it because you had to.

    It is a defense that the person who engaged in the prohibited conduct was compelled to do so by threat of imminent serious bodily injury to himself or another person.
    But that's not what I'm talking about. In what I'm talking about there's no necessity defense. The person is factually guilty of, say, carrying a handgun without a license. If put in front of a judge, a "guilty" verdict would be pretty assured. But local juries don't like it. Same reason we don't file shoplifters who fight loss prevention as strong armed robberies despite both the law and case law saying it is. Local juries don't like it. Defense attorneys know that, request a jury trial, and you just wasted your resources on a losing case more often then not.

    So they don't file on the "victim" because they'd likely lose that case and instead use the potential for a case as incentive to cooperate against the "suspect." The "victim" cooperates in prosecution, strengthening that case, and doesn't have to roll the dice on which jury he gets. The prosecutor gets one strong case instead of two shitty ones. If the "victim" is a shitbag, and they often are, they'll be "suspect" next time so we'll get them then. If they aren't a shitbag, they get another swing at doing things the right way instead of having a record.
    Sorta around sometimes for some of your shitty mod needs.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by BehindBlueI's View Post
    Our prosecutor's office has historically been *very* hesitant to file "no license to carry" and "felon in possession" (absent serious violent felon status) for most situations mirroring that. One, we want the victim's cooperation against the "real criminal" and gets the "not in the best interest of justice" turn-down*. Two, jury nullification concerns as local juries don't like it.
    Ditto for the rest of New York. In fact, we just had a case in the area where a somewhat-unhinged guy living in his dead dad's condemned home shot and killed a (IIRC) mother-son robbery team with the late father's unlicensed revolver. No charges filed, but I believe they confiscated the gun. I don't think the son had the financial or mental resources to go through the permitting process, anyway.

  8. #8
    The R in F.A.R.T RevolverRob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duces Tecum View Post
    [SIZE=1][COLOR=#111111][FONT=Georgia]A Brooklyn, New York, grocery store was reportedly arrested after using an unlicensed gun to shoot an alleged knife-wielding robbery suspect Monday night.
    Damn...New York has gotten crazy...apparently the grocery stores are sentient now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BehindBlueI's View Post
    Our prosecutor's office has historically been *very* hesitant to file "no license to carry" and "felon in possession" (absent serious violent felon status) for most situations mirroring that. One, we want the victim's cooperation against the "real criminal" and gets the "not in the best interest of justice" turn-down*. Two, jury nullification concerns as local juries don't like it.

    *Preemptively, I get the "real criminal" is dead here and not subject to prosecution, just talking in general.
    In NY it’s not just “no license to carry” which is a misdemeanor in most places. In free America, things are generally allowed unless they are specifically permitted. In NY (and NJ) things are prohibited unless specifically permitted.

    In NY the possession of a handgun is a felony unless you fall into the two exceptions: LE /military or have a NY handgun license.

    Essentially everyone is a prohibited person unless the state grants you a waiver.

    In NY cases involving illegals guns, the necessity defense only covers the actual use of force. IN NY, especially NYC , legitimate self defense situations in which the use of force is not charged but the firearms violations are charged are common. Bernie Goetz being the classic example.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wise_A View Post
    Ditto for the rest of New York. In fact, we just had a case in the area where a somewhat-unhinged guy living in his dead dad's condemned home shot and killed a (IIRC) mother-son robbery team with the late father's unlicensed revolver. No charges filed, but I believe they confiscated the gun. I don't think the son had the financial or mental resources to go through the permitting process, anyway.
    No charges were filed because it was upstate. In NYC /LI etc that would not have turned out as well.

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