I think I want a canoe

[OlongJohnson]

@peterb

I'm pretty sure my age and shoe size were in the single digits when I became aware of Platt Monfort's work. I believe I need something that can take a little more scratching on sticks and rocks without pressing pause on the trip to fix it.

I grew up in a town with about 15,000 people and seven marinas, not too far from @misanthropist's digs. The interesting mix of wealthy yacht owners, hippies who like building things and people who killed fish for a living led to boat building of all forms being a thing, from strip-built canoes and kayaks in garages and basements to decent-sized ocean-going vessels down at the port. My first few real jobs were all in the industry.

There's a part of me that really wants one of these:

https://www.clcboats.com/shop/boats/...-boat-kit.html



It's virtually aesthetic perfection. But I know I also really don't need another project of that magnitude.

[mtnbkr]

@TBone550 I’ve got two perfectly good kayaks you can have. Nothing wrong with them.

@TBone550, take the kayaks even if you get a canoe or two. Use the canoe for hauling gear and put your overflow peeps in the kayaks. For unloaded day trips, kayaks are more fun than canoes even on still water. Gliding along down at water level (assuming sit-in kayaks and not sit-on) is peaceful and relaxing (especially if you bring beer). A buddy of mine has a couple sit-ins and we have taken a few day trips (5-11 miles) down the Bull Run and Occoquan creeks here in NoVA.

One warning though...
If you get ahead of your friend(s) and want to linger mid stream so they can catch up, DO NOT grab that overhead branch so you can stay in place. You will turn perpendicular to the current and you will roll over enough that you take on water. You will sink. You will get wet.

Or so I've heard.

Semi-related...I would love to find a lanyard stud that could replace the grip screw in my LCR (such are made for standard Hogue grips, but the LCR's is a bit different). I think that would be the bee's knees for snake and pirate repellent while kayaking/canoeing.

ETA:
I took this picture nearly 2 years ago while kayak fishing on the Occoquan Creek near Manassas after a bunch of summer storms had passed through the area. With the high water and wet trees dripping, it felt like kayaking down the Amazon. I caught a huge (to me) catfish on a white grub jig. It pulled me around a bit.

There was a bald eagle's nest nearby and I got to watch her (I presume, wouldn't want to assume gender) fly around. I could hear chicks in the nest too.



Chris

[Poconnor]

I have my grandfather’s old town wooden Canoe. It needs to be restored and I should sell it. I haven’t use it in decades. But I have too many great memories of it from my childhood. I’m sure wooden canoes are not as durable as a modern canoe but a wood and canvas canoe is quiet when it glides through the water. I really should reskin it and take it on a vacation to a lake in Maine.

[vaspence]

I’m a big fan of Old Town canoes for the type of boating you’re talking about doing. Easily one of the most popular canoes in Virginia and very durable. They come used in two types of materials. Light (royalex) and not light (any Discovery series or polyethylene).

The royalex boats are noticeably lighter than the Discoverys. The royalex boats are no longer made by Old Town but there are a gazillion of them out there and they are on craigslist frequently. I have two of them, a Pathfinder (14’19, 57lbs) and a Camper (16’, 59lbs). I’ve owned my Pathfinder since 1994 and I bought the Camper used a couple years ago from a guy who bought in the late 90s. Either will handle a couple of guys and gear for a trip. They are also easily carried by one person. I routinely have my two youngest boys in these canoes with me and we have plenty of room for a day trip fishing.

The Discovery series are tanks. We have 2 158s (15’8, 80lbs). They can be a handful by yourself but good technique helps save the back when loading/unloading. You can’t hurt them and my two were used as rental boats by us for the last 8 years. Once you have them in the water and loaded they are awesome. Fairly unsinkable, we used them to get my oldest son’s scout troop ready for a BWCA trip and they swamped the boats at least a dozen times. We’ve also had it happen a couple of times to renters on the river.

Aluminum Canoes - The first canoe I bought was a Grumman 17’. I paddled the tar out of that boat on the James here in Richmond and it held up fine. It was a “geologist boat” as it seemed to find and bang off every rock in the river. Or at least the ones it didn’t stick to. A great canoe and I’d buy another one in a heartbeat if it came around for a good price and I needed a canoe. When we did the BWCA trip with my son’s scout troop we took the 18’ Grumman they had over the two WeNoNah fiberglass/Kevlar canoes and had a ball. They do have a small keel on the bottom which will find rocks in rivers but on a lake it seems to help with tracking. Or at least I told myself so. They also do a good job as a party bar when supported by two sawhorses and filled with ice.

I don’t claim to be an SME but I just closed a kayak/canoe/paddleboard rental/guiding business I owned for 8 years. I gave the above information based on my own preferences and experiences. However, my experience also shows that the guy in the $150 Walmart kayak or $300 craigslist Coleman canoe has just as much fun as the guy in the $1000+ kayak or canoe.

[Welder]

Man, this is great, keep it coming.

Is ease of repair the main advantage of an aluminum canoe? Or is it just an obsolete material these days that has a taste of nostalgia attached? Or???? Being a metalworker by trade, I'm naturally curious about the material choices.

[Trigger]

Funny this thread should arise, my wife is currently shopping for a kayak. Something simple to toss in the 4Runner and go flat water paddling for a little evening exercise.

[flyrodr]

Man, this is great, keep it coming.

Is ease of repair the main advantage of an aluminum canoe? Or is it just an obsolete material these days that has a taste of nostalgia attached? Or???? Being a metalworker by trade, I'm naturally curious about the material choices.

It's been a long time since I had a canoe, or shopped for one. Several of the comments received so far probably ought to be bolded/underlined.

For instance, the (and please excuse the lack of proper terms for canoe parts) "general purpose" canoes are OK at most things, but not necessarily the best at any. They track straight, because the keel is flat. And thus they don't turn as well as "whitewater" canoes that have more rocker (I think that's the term), where there's less of the keel on the water. Thus they turn better . . . or veer off course if your paddling isn't up to par.

Weight - - - I'll echo the earlier post. Light is good, 'cause you'll be carrying the canoe, lifting it up and into/on your vehicle.

Material. I'm not sure if this is current, but aluminum has near zero upkeep (assuming you don't beat holes into it). It is terribly noisy and cold (assuming the water is cold). It can be patched. And rivets can work loose and need replacing. Fiberglass is universal, because it's easy to work with, pretty durable, and OK to repair. Kevlar and similar techy relatives can make a lighter canoe, but don't think they're "bulletproof" like a vest. Best I remember, these materials produced a stiffer/lighter hull. The molded poly materials are usually chosen because they can be practically beaten to death without an issue. But, the molded canoes can't be (or in the past weren't able to be) molded into as complex curves as a glass/kevlar boat can be. They are more rounded on the "edges". And, pretty much lacking any frame, they are more flexible. Together those two features make them less desirable in flat water. Many are heavier than the corresponding glass or aluminum canoe.

Maintenance/Storage. Consider where you'll store the canoes. If inside a garage or shed, no particular issue. If outside, any wooden parts (think the nice gunwales/seats on a glass/kevlar canoe) can be damaged by prolonged outside storage if not kept up. Don't know if you're in a place where theft is an issue, but canoes left outside can be tempting targets for drive-by theft.

Best guidance I got back when I was first shopping was at an outdoor store that sold all sorts of canoes, and allowed "test drives". If they offer all, they can give you pros/cons of each, and maybe even have some used ones.

Good luck!

[Seven_Sicks_Two]

This thread is relevant to my interests...

My shooting/hunting buddy and I have been kicking around the idea of picking up a Craigslist canoe to get into some tough to reach sports on the Columbia River for next year's duck season.

Other than a little experience 20+ years ago at Boy Scout camp, I know next to nothing about canoeing.

[MickAK]

Man, this is great, keep it coming.

Is ease of repair the main advantage of an aluminum canoe? Or is it just an obsolete material these days that has a taste of nostalgia attached? Or???? Being a metalworker by trade, I'm naturally curious about the material choices.

Aluminum is definitely considered an obsolete material. Really, fiberglass repair isn't that hard or expensive. I just think at your price point you might have a tough time finding a decent canoe and you're more likely to find a good aluminum one that has a hole in it and therefore getting sold for nothing if it didn't get scrapped. If you've never welded on old aluminum it can be a pain.

I believe the aluminum canoe thing came from Grumman wanting to stay in business and decided to make canoes. It's considerably more expensive to set up to make aluminum canoes versus modern plastics/fiberglass, but they are iconic and so still exist.

[Welder]

Aluminum is definitely considered an obsolete material. Really, fiberglass repair isn't that hard or expensive. I just think at your price point you might have a tough time finding a decent canoe and you're more likely to find a good aluminum one that has a hole in it and therefore getting sold for nothing if it didn't get scrapped. If you've never welded on old aluminum it can be a pain.

I believe the aluminum canoe thing came from Grumman wanting to stay in business and decided to make canoes. It's considerably more expensive to set up to make aluminum canoes versus modern plastics/fiberglass, but they are iconic and so still exist.

Yeah, I did some extra reading this afternoon. From what I gather, alum's main advantage is that it can be stored outside indefinitely, where the other materials react with the sunlight and / or weather. Having worked with aluminum in the past, I absolutely believe them when they talk about temperature transfer from it on a hot or cold day magnifying your 'experience.' From some weight comparisons, it's often but not always a few pounds heavier than a comparable non-metallic canoe. Several people mentioned that it would stick to rocks rather than slide over, but also that if it got dented you could just hammer the dents back out and be on your way. Unless it was wrapped around a rock or the frame structure was damaged. Rivets could leak but there's sealer for that.

Looking at prices in my area, yeah, I can pick up an aluminum canoe for a couple hundred bucks. But also the cheap (I guess) Pelican and Coleman canoes are in that price range.