Let's talk PDW's

[Corse]

Besides the aforementioned MCX, there is also the CZ Bren 805 (which makes me wonder if the Bren 2 will come in .300 BLK down the line...), B&T APC300, Robinson Armament XCR, Saiga AK-101, and Bushmaster ACR. The HK237 and HK437 exist on paper, as does the FN SCAR-SC, though those are probably a moot point for any civilian purchase.

I bought an MCX and 805 both for their folding stock capabilities. Unfortunately, any conversion barrels seem to be MIA with the generational changes for the 805, and to some extent the MCX (I have a pre virtus).

With the 805, the 11.5” 5.56 barrel is too long to fit in most regular backpacks. If I remember correctly it is around 23” folded. Also with the design of the upper, you cannot make the barrel any shorter. Maybe the gen 2 will have more support/modularity. Other than that, the 805 is a nice rifle.

[Corse]

I was thinking half-track, honestly.

And in that case, maybe I need to rethink the "Thompson pistol" situation...Custom Smith MFG has a brace option and hey, A-O has 100-round drums.

They all fall to (a 100-rounds of) hardball...

What about the GHM45 or LWRC offering? No 100 rd drums though.

[Doc_Glock]

Theoretically possible to assemble at home with 7.5” barrel, fat ha guard, and can?

Yes indeed. This is an Aero 8.5” barrel, their large diameter hand guard and Gemtech 300 GMT put together about three years ago. It’s the closest thing I have to a “PDW” and it won’t fit in a GR1 that is for sure.

[Wake27]

I'd forgotten about drums. Magpul is releasing that 50 round Glock drum mag, bet that'd be solid in an APC Pro.

[WobblyPossum]

I'd forgotten about drums. Magpul is releasing that 50 round Glock drum mag, bet that'd be solid in an APC Pro.

I hope it’s as reliable as their AR mags and not as unreliable as their other Glock mags.

[RevolverRob]

What about the GHM45 or LWRC offering? No 100 rd drums though.

Yea, we definitely explored those in the Kriss thread. The GHM45 is very tempting, though @GJM mentioned some magazine issues.

A Thompson would be far more toy than serious use, but when someone is hanging out the back of my non-existent half-track and shooting at non-existent corona-zombies, it would clearly be great.

If the B&T mags work, I'd be pretty happy with a GHM45 as a primary tool, but 9mm is of course cheaper to shoot and run.

[LittleLebowski]

I may have been too vague, but the point I was trying to make is that major ammunition manufacturers tend to populate their LE line with their best options for people shootin'.

Nice job on the deer. Did I miss a pic of that in the hunting thread?

Prolly. It was at Giving Back’s property. KAC SR-30 SBR 11.5”. It’s on Giving Back’s website: https://givingbackusa.org/

[GJM]

1) just checked tracking, and the TP9-N is not scheduled to arrive until Thursday. Don’t they know we are in a hurry.

I have been thinking about my evaluation of the TP9. Will be checking collapsed length, weight, reliability, accuracy, ease of manipulations, how it fits in the GR1, magazine impressions (I have 15 and 30 rounders coming) and shooting performance compared to the APC9 Pro and an EDC handgun.

2) since SouthNarc is following this thread, been discussing with Tom_Jones and YVK, what curriculum changes to MUC are likely in the works. Stuff like, we used to shoot people inside six feet with a mask, now we shoot people inside 6-20 feet without a mask. Are grooming gestures with a mask still reliable pre attack indicators.

[GearFondler]

I don’t think all sub guns are PDWs or that all PDWs are rifle caliber. But I do like the effort made here so far by TGS and others to define what a PDW is.

So far the definition of PDW seems to be ?

1. capability of being Shoulder fired
2. Designed for concealment over performance, ideally in the ~20” range
3. Adds performance capability over a standard concealed pistol but carried because I can’t have a rifle, even a “commando” size rifle is to large for the PDW role

What else?

It's possibly semantics, but I would argue that the original PDW definition was "Designed for Portability over performance"... Making it absolutely as small as possible was not the goal, rather just small enough to make it considerably more practical to lug around than a battle rifle.

[StraitR]

1) just checked tracking, and the TP9-N is not scheduled to arrive until Thursday. Don’t they know we are in a hurry.

I have been thinking about my evaluation of the TP9. Will be checking collapsed length, weight, reliability, accuracy, ease of manipulations, how it fits in the GR1, magazine impressions (I have 15 and 30 rounders coming) and shooting performance compared to the APC9 Pro and an EDC handgun.

2) since SouthNarc is following this thread, been discussing with Tom_Jones and YVK, what curriculum changes to MUC are likely in the works. Stuff like, we used to shoot people inside six feet with a mask, now we shoot people inside 6-20 feet without a mask. Are grooming gestures with a mask still reliable pre attack indicators.

I'm really getting into this compact ​long gun thing.

1) Looking forward to your TP9-N impressions.

2) With almost 500 posts about hardware, culminating in a general consensus on what defines a PDW, any software discussion up to and including deployment/usage would be be outstanding.

ETA: I have two older packs, Eagle 3-Day Assault (probably 15+ years old) and TT Litespeed Assault, both of which easily take my DD PDW (no can) with excess room to spare. It actually kind of swims around in both, and would need some sort of shoring to be useful. Between it fitting in my GR1 and those two packs, I'm wanting to figure out best practice for deployment from the standard two-strap backpack carry position.

ETA: I believe a Q Whistle Tip would be beneficial for backpack storage/carry and use without the can.