Let's talk PDW's

[El Cid]

Yeah, it's sexy, right? Great aesthetics, soft recoil, super compact, and everyone who owns one raves about them. You could carry it in a very small bag, or in a regular sized backpack that can still carry all your other junk for a road trip or what have you. As much as I like watching MACs videos he seems to like every gun he reviews.....but at the same time, he has two TP9s and the real MP9, so that kind of says something.

Yet, ToddG's maxim, "uncommon guns are uncommon for a reason" keeps banging around in my head and prevents me from dropping the coin on one.

Yea I need to start budgeting for one of those. Lol! Once again P-F is costing me money. Besides my APC came with a B&T mag I’m not using because I have the Glock lower. If I already have the mag, then I must get a TP9 to use it in right?

I get why Todd would say that. But the Swiss seem to know what they’re doing with guns and watches. My APC9 PRO is amazing and I have no reason to think this will be any different. And part of the reason B&T weapons are rare is the price of admission.

[Corse]

You mentioned 80 yards in one post, not multiple, and the statement you made that I'm addressing is patently false and didn't include that. You wrote that 7.5" barrels basically turn a 5.56 into a 5.7 that pokes holes, and that's simply not true. I'm not talking about 5.7's efficacy, I'm not talking about your affinity for MP5ks, nor whether you think a 7.5" 5.56 is a real rifle or not.

As for personal, Deflave doesn't seem to care about your bad info and I don't own any 7.5" gun that I would be emotionally invested in. I think they'd be fucking miserable, personally, but people trying to pass bad info as the truth on a technical forum is still bad info that needs to be corrected.

You are correct, I mentioned the 80 yrds in only one previous post, I was incorrect in assuming that it was understood I was continuing the same line of thinking. That’s the problem with the internet I guess.

I stand by that 5.56 out of a 7.5” barrel after a short range, probably well inside 100 yrds, would most likely act just like a 5.7.

If this is incorrect, please show me the ballistic tests. I don’t have the time, resources or desire to do the testing myself. I’ll talk what appears to be reputable info and do my best to make decisions based on that.

I’m trying to pass what I’ve learned on. If you have better info then share your sources. And if you don’t think MP5k s are cool then I don’t know what to tell you.

[Corse]

Mags for the Pro are backwards compatible to the legacy guns, mag in grip has some advantages for guys who shoot autopistols more than AR platforms. Polymer lower weighs less than the legacy designs, pic rail up top and a side charging handle.

And it looks shit hot in SBR trim too.
http://www.titleiiarms.com/UZI_Pro_O...STOCK_ARM.html

Those are pretty cool little guns. That would be a piece of cake to fit in a regular bag.

[ldunnmobile]

I ran a B&T APC9 for over a year. Amazing little gun. But ultimately I sold it because I vastly prefer a 10.5” AR pistol. The capability of the 5.56 even in a short package was too great compared to 9mm. JMHO

[jandbj]

CH does reciprocate. Don't flag your thumb.

Uzi Pro CH is non reciprocating.

[StraitR]

Uzi Pro CH is non reciprocating.

FF to 9:21

[El Cid]

I ran a B&T APC9 for over a year. Amazing little gun. But ultimately I sold it because I vastly prefer a 10.5” AR pistol. The capability of the 5.56 even in a short package was too great compared to 9mm. JMHO

I don’t think I’ve seen anyone suggest a 9mm PDW/PCC is as effective as a 5.56 or other rifle caliber. For me the draw of them is that I can fit one in a much smaller case or bag than any SBR I’d trust. My APC even uses Glock mags that I have everywhere. The TP9 is smaller yet and with a can will be dramatically quieter than a suppressed 5.56/300BLK. For me it’s like a G43 or J-frame. I carry them not because they’re the best, but because I can’t carry a proper sized pistol.

How was your TP9 in terms of reliability? Any ammo it didn’t like such as JHP’s? Thanks!

[Maple Syrup Actual]

What stock are you using? Overall length?

This is the perfect size for a 5.56 gun, IMO.

...EDIT: Same questions about stock and OAL asked above...

I may do a 5.56 version like that at some point.

OAL is just under 25". The stock cuts a little less than three inches off the length.

That particular stock is an NEA CCS. There's things about it I like, but among the things I didn't really like was the number of times I had to cut another quarter coil off the spring, looking for the sweet spot.

They gassed their guns pretty hard so I guess this stock was tuned to that "spec". They work once you get them dialed in but you need to dial then in.

But I believe it's out of production now, anyway. I keep it mostly for sentimental reasons, having spent a lot of time with the company founder, who is a real character, maybe best compared to Alex Robinson. He is not well liked in Canadian gun circles, for reasons which range from totally deserved, to completely irrational. His contribution to the Canadian AR scene is almost universally misunderstood and undervalued. He sold the company, as far as I know, and is pretty invisible these days, which makes me sad because I always wanted to write a book about him and his company, and I always dreamed I would be able to call it "Catastrophic Success: The Rise, Fall, Rise, Fall, Rise, Fall and Rise of Canada's Strangest Arms Dealer, as told to Canada's Strangest Arms Writer".

But he got tired of the stress of the company, I think. I believe he is mainly interested in suppressors and automatic watches these days.


Since I got the stock tuned in, the performance has been good.

[Maple Syrup Actual]

Oh, and all the B&T stuff is excellent; I have used it all fairly extensively. But again, 9mm. It's just not enough punch for the size of the guns.

[StraitR]

OAL is just under 25". The stock cuts a little less than three inches off the length.

That particular stock is an NEA CCS. There's things about it I like, but among the things I didn't really like was the number of times I had to cut another quarter coil off the spring, looking for the sweet spot.

They gassed their guns pretty hard so I guess this stock was tuned to that "spec". They work once you get them dialed in but you need to dial then in.

But I believe it's out of production now, anyway. I keep it mostly for sentimental reasons, having spent a lot of time with the company founder, who is a real character, maybe best compared to Alex Robinson. He is not well liked in Canadian gun circles, for reasons which range from totally deserved, to completely irrational. His contribution to the Canadian AR scene is almost universally misunderstood and undervalued. He sold the company, as far as I know, and is pretty invisible these days, which makes me sad because I always wanted to write a book about him and his company, and I always dreamed I would be able to call it "Catastrophic Success: The Rise, Fall, Rise, Fall, Rise, Fall and Rise of Canada's Strangest Arms Dealer, as told to Canada's Strangest Arms Writer".

But he got tired of the stress of the company, I think. I believe he is mainly interested in suppressors and automatic watches these days.


Since I got the stock tuned in, the performance has been good.

Hahaha... I never get enough of your posts. Always a backstory, always a quality read. Where's that clapping emoji when you need one?

That's fantastic. "Just under 25 inches" is about as good as it's going to get for a 10.5" barreled AR. For the sake of comparison, my DDM4 PDW with 7" barrel is just a smidge over 21" (a smidge being 1/16", or 1.5875mm) with the Cherry Bomb. It was 20.75" with the factory linear brake. And it feels tiny, so adding 3-4" wouldn't be much of a stretch, IMO, and definitely worth it for 5.56.

Anyone have a 10.X barrel with LAW folder they wouldn't mind measuring in the folded postiion, for science? Asking for a friend.