Vogel Just posted a 2.98 FAST!!!!!!

[joshs]

Bob and Ben are used to shooting for much higher stakes than a FAST coin . . .

It isn't only pressure that's the problem, it's the fact that there aren't any do overs. Do you see a difference between what you will do in a match that you want to win and what you can achieve in practice? If the FAST (and it's current penalty structure) were a stage in a match, would you shoot it as fast you thought you could possible shoot a clean run or at a speed where you could guarantee a clean run?

Look at El Prez, which has a much less punishing penalty structure. I've seen lots of people who can shoot close to a 4 second El Prez, but whenever they shoot it as a classifier, their times are usually between 5 and 6 seconds.

[beltjones]

It isn't only pressure that's the problem, it's the fact that there aren't any do overs. Do you see a difference between what you will do in a match that you want to win and what you can achieve in practice? If the FAST (and it's current penalty structure) were a stage in a match, would you shoot it as fast you thought you could possible shoot a clean run or at a speed where you could guarantee a clean run?

Look at El Prez, which has a much less punishing penalty structure. I've seen lots of people who can shoot close to a 4 second El Prez, but whenever they shoot it as a classifier, their times are usually between 5 and 6 seconds.

That's a very good point. Bob even wrote that it was his 2nd and 4th attempts that yielded the best (clean) result that day, so obviously these guys are really pushing in terms of speed.

Maybe Ben could tell us how much he thinks he would back off the time if this were "for real" and he had to guarantee hits.

[Ben Stoeger]

Bob and Ben are used to shooting for much higher stakes than a FAST coin, believe it or not.

Both of these guys are world class shooters who compete against the best in the world for the most prestigious titles. I'm sorry, but I think they have the tools to cope with the pressure of standing next to an instructor.

2 points.

First, I am not sure what higher stakes there are... but that is just me.

Second, some instructors make me really nervous. I am also just kind of nervous by nature.

[Ben Stoeger]

It isn't only pressure that's the problem, it's the fact that there aren't any do overs. Do you see a difference between what you will do in a match that you want to win and what you can achieve in practice? If the FAST (and it's current penalty structure) were a stage in a match, would you shoot it as fast you thought you could possible shoot a clean run or at a speed where you could guarantee a clean run?

Look at El Prez, which has a much less punishing penalty structure. I've seen lots of people who can shoot close to a 4 second El Prez, but whenever they shoot it as a classifier, their times are usually between 5 and 6 seconds.

I personally would be happy with 6 seconds on the FAST in a high pressure situation.

[gtmtnbiker98]

Nothing like Todd standing right next to you saying "no pressure." I do well myself on the FAST until class time comes then rest assured, you can add 1.5 seconds to my score. You can set you watch by it.

[JV_]

IIRC - My fastest cold FAST was done at the Free Pistol/Carbine Clinic for Veterans, I was not shooting but helping out. That was a clean 5.05.

[TCinVA]

A sub three second FAST is impressive, but I don't think there is a danger of Todd going broke handing out coins or running out of room on the wall of fame.

[beltjones]

Here's a thought:

The guys with the fastest times on this drill also happen to be the world's best USPSA shooters. I would include IDPA, but Ben doesn't shoot IDPA.

Why would that be? Why not the guys that practice this drill the most? You could make the argument that Ben, Bob, Dave, et al are just naturally the best, and that makes them the best at whatever they do. I doubt they would agree with that.

Todd has consistently said that the way to shoot the FAST fast is not to run it over and over again, but to practice and perfect the different aspects of the drill.

So what's going on here?

USPSA requires shooters to be prepared to handle an incredible variety of shooting challenges, from tight shots on distant moving targets to multiple strong hand and weak hand Bill drills on some classifiers. At the world shoot they had to tie one hand to a cart while shooting a stage; one's confidence with shooting and gun handling has to be pretty good to not freak out when presented with that. The point is, the argument that these guys train themselves to the point that they can only shoot two rounds on each target, that they need a race holster and a fancy belt, and that they aren't as accurate as the "tactical" guys just doesn't hold water. The variety of challenges they have to prepare for to be at the top of the USPSA game also prepares them to be the best at shooting from concealment and hitting lighting quick emergency reloads, two things you rarely see at a USPSA match. Simply put, the shooting and gun handling skills necessary to move to the top of USPSA translate to any type of pistol shooting drill, and those who disdain that type of shooting for not being "tactical" enough or for ingraining bad habits are missing the boat entirely.

Sure, it's easy to say that someone can shoot the FAST in 3.5 seconds or faster because he is a "robot mutant cyborg" or whatever, but it's probably more accurate to say that he has just put in better, smarter work. Maybe these guys do have a chip implanted in their brains, or maybe USPSA really prepares people to just plain shoot. Can anyone really doubt that at this point?

[beltjones]

A sub three second FAST is impressive, but I don't think there is a danger of Todd going broke handing out coins or running out of room on the wall of fame.

I agree. As long as you have to take a class in order for the run to be valid, there is very little danger of overcrowding on the FAST wall.

[JV_]

I agree. As long as you have to take a class in order for the run to be valid, there is very little danger of overcrowding on the FAST wall.

Actually, it's not just a class.

http://pistol-training.com/fastest

Only scores earned during a pistol-training.com class or similar ptc-recognized event are eligible for record status or winning a F.A.S.T. Challenge Coin.