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Thread: The Case for a 20" Shotgun, No Side Saddle, Non-Flite Control Buck

  1. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by SouthNarc View Post
    Sanch since you're an AMIS alum here's some vid from an AMIS class where Adam from Aridus Industries was running a sim barrel in a pump gun for the course work and I gave him some instruction on that.


    https://www.facebook.com/38499303836...5182233347890/
    That was excellent. Thank you.
    I was into 10mm Auto before it sold out and went mainstream, but these days I'm here for the revolver and epidemiology information.

  2. #12
    I recently reinstalled my Vang Comp +2 on my 870. I used to use a Wilson +1 out of balance concerns, but given that I load down one, having less capacity than a J Frame always felt weird. I've noticed the balance concern has largely gone away after four months at the gym, FWIW.

    I also removed the Vang Comp 6-round side saddle in favor of a 2-round card from Browncoat Tactical. That allows for two incredibly unlikely emergency reloads, and in my view did far more to aid in balancing than the +1 tube did.

    I use FFC as recommended in both shotgun classes I've taken. With my XS rifle sight barrel, hits are pretty easy. I've been meaning to have my receiver drilled and tapped for a 1913 rail to add a red dot sight, but I haven't gotten around to that yet. Maybe that'll be the frivilous thing I spend the stimulus cash on, who knows.

    I'm not so sure the spread-out buck = greater ballistics thing is a thing. My understanding is the FFC shot column spreads out inside of ballistic gel, and the tight impact takes away the tissue's elasticity to some extent, causing ballistic good things. I'm probably butchering that, but it's what's in the back of my head from reading the ballistics forum.

    18" is really on the verge of being too long in my opinion, but I haven't convinced myself to go down the NFA route at this time. My use for a shotgun is basically retrieve and point at the door. If I'm anywhere else in the home, a pistol becomes the primary because that's what I have handy.

  3. #13
    Site Supporter OlongJohnson's Avatar
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    Somewhere on here there's another thread about 20ga for defensive role and available ammo options. Worth digging that up and reading it.

    I think it was @GJM who recently compared dimensions and weight of the 1301 to other options, including an NFA Benelli and a 20 ga. With the light weight and short length of the 1301, and the advantage in load development that 12ga has, it's pretty difficult to construct an argument for anything else. DB's comments on the recent P&S about duck guns (available variants of the 1301, it turns out) vs tactical looking stuff may be relevant.

    My thinking at this point is that if you accept that "1301 and FFC" is the shotgun equivalent of "G19 and something off Doc's list," there are quite a lot fewer reasons to look at something else for shotguns than there are for pistols.
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    Not another dime.

  4. #14
    Hammertime
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lester Polfus View Post
    That was excellent. Thank you.
    Indeed. Double thanks.

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by SouthNarc View Post
    Sanch since you're an AMIS alum here's some vid from an AMIS class where Adam from Aridus Industries was running a sim barrel in a pump gun for the course work and I gave him some instruction on that.


    https://www.facebook.com/38499303836...5182233347890/
    Do you recommend the same techniques with an SBR or shorty shotty?
    I had an ER nurse in a class. I noticed she kept taking all head shots. Her response when asked why, "'I've seen too many people who have been shot in the chest putting up a fight in the ER." Point taken.

  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by jlw View Post
    Do you recommend the same techniques with an SBR or shorty shotty?

    Really subjective Lee but I tend to run 11.5" guns, 12.5" and 14" shottys probably a little more over arm than underarm. Also with shotgun specifically the difference between a pistol grip and a standard stock is significant.

  7. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Lester Polfus View Post
    That was excellent. Thank you.
    Sure thing guys!

  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by BehindBlueI's View Post
    I've yet to see a home invasion not repelled by the application of a shotgun that was fired. Literally every loss was when the home owner failed to fire the shotgun, either getting entangled and losing it, frantically working to remove a trigger lock when discovered, or just not being willing to pull the trigger. I've yet to see anyone need a reload. As such, I think it's pretty easy to overthink the gear requirements.
    While I certainly won't argue with the semi-auto shotgun, particularly the 1301 as the optimal solution, I'm curious if you've seen a justified shooting involving a citizen where they short stroked the pump and it led to a negative outcome.
    I was into 10mm Auto before it sold out and went mainstream, but these days I'm here for the revolver and epidemiology information.

  9. #19
    Member
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    Love my shotguns. Home defense, room entry, hunting... You name it and a shotty can fill in (okay, not long range). You can get a 590 7 shot with 18.5 inch barrel. Do you plan on clearing your home or hunkering down with a phone in the corner of your bedroom. In either case, an extra 1.5 inches of barrel won't make a real difference. The only MUST HAVE for a defensive shotgun is a WML, IMHO.

  10. #20
    Modding this sack of shit BehindBlueI's's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lester Polfus View Post
    While I certainly won't argue with the semi-auto shotgun, particularly the 1301 as the optimal solution, I'm curious if you've seen a justified shooting involving a citizen where they short stroked the pump and it led to a negative outcome.
    Nope. I won't say it couldn't happen, but I've yet to see it make a difference.

    I have seen an outside the house incident were more ammunition/available reload would have potentially mattered, and that was a targeted attack and not the primary reason for failure to stop the primary aggressor's active attack. Hillbilly lover's pinwheel resulted in a shootout in the driveway with papaw of the target's girlfriend's sister (you might need a diagram) coming out of the neighboring house with a shotgun. Single shot, IIRC, fired one shot and took the primary aggressor's headlight out. Intentionally. Mamaw was over his shoulder yelling "don't kill him" for some reason. Primary aggressor continued to fire at his intended target until he emptied his second gun then left. Primary target also emptied a handgun at the primary aggressor with no hits.
    Sorta around sometimes for some of your shitty mod needs.

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