Shooting at “your rhythm”

[Duelist]

To restate my original point, this thread isn’t about improving how you grip the pistol or pull the trigger. We have had many threads about those topics, since the beginning of this forum. This is about harvesting the most points per second, with whatever skill level you currently have. My belief, at least for me, is there is a shooting rhythm that yields the best result for me, and going faster or slower yields a worse result. That is at odds with shooting at a specific qual pace or standard, because that pace may be just right, too fast or too slow for you. If it is the right pace for you, it works, but if it is too fast or slow, it does not work.

Logical.

[JHC]

Related to fixed time drills, Gabe and I have discussed par times over the years, and concluded they often reflect the ability of the person establishing the par time. If the par time is easy for you, it essentially becomes a no time drill. If the par is impossible, it encourages haste which often results in poor performance. I get a par time for evaluating ability against a standard, but don’t like a par for improving ability.

Funny and that may well be the case. As I was schooled by a former competition shooter but extensive "operational" shooter, a proper methodology of setting a par for a standard is to define a problem/task, make a best effort to define a reasonable time that solving that problem may afford (based on operational experience in volume) and there's your par. He emphasized it made no difference whether is was attainable by (me in the context of that discussion) a particular shooter. The problem was the problem.

In a related example I observed how often "in my experience" my deer hunting shots in relatively heavy cover, came down to a tight shot that I had just a couple seconds MAX to decide on and execute. He then observed that in combat he'd observed a pretty similar pattern.

[AGR416]

When you use the term "rythm", are you in reality talking about splits?

Just trying to understand context.

[KneeShot]

To apply that analogy here, I would say to drive at the limit of your headlights, not beyond what you can see or less that what you can see. The challenge is, based on different skills and equipment, each shooter is effectively equipped with an individual set of headlights that must be calibrated through experience, and these headlights can vary by the day.

Related to fixed time drills, Gabe and I have discussed par times over the years, and concluded they often reflect the ability of the person establishing the par time. If the par time is easy for you, it essentially becomes a no time drill. If the par is impossible, it encourages haste which often results in poor performance. I get a par time for evaluating ability against a standard, but don’t like a par for improving ability.

GJM - than what from the par time can you use to improve ability? Respectfully.

Jeremy

[GJM]

When you use the term "rythm", are you in reality talking about splits?

Just trying to understand context.

No. Two shooters can shoot the same splits, and based on their recoil and trigger control, have very different results. Rhythm, as I am describing it here, means figuring out the pace where you are harvesting the most points per second with your level of technique.

[GJM]

GJM - than what from the par time can you use to improve ability? Respectfully.

Jeremy

Not sure I understand your question, can you expand upon your question?

[KneeShot]

GJM - than what from the par time can you use to improve ability? Respectfully.

Jeremy

Not sure I understand your question, can you expand upon your question?

This is a neat conversation and is throwing me for a loop. JHC and AGR416 comments are helping me digest it. Here is what I’m struggling with -

“I get a par time for evaluating ability against a standard, but don’t like a par for improving ability”.

If we do not use a standard to measure against than WHAT are we using to improve ability?

I think the par time is a great ability improver - it helps w/ the micro adjustments in all of the fundamentals. Here are a few examples - The FAST drill. It has a PAR time..if your not making the time you need to clean up what your messy at, wether it’s your press out, prepping the trigger, etc.. Next example - I want to take Gabe’s class. I’ve read that he gives out pins for hitting under a certain PAR time.

Isn’t the goal to improve ability to hit faster times more accurately? Or to - speed up your rhythm of the fundamentals - and make the necessary hits...while calling your shots and following through?

Good conversation!

Jeremy

[GJM]

This is a neat conversation and is throwing me for a loop. JHC and AGR416 comments are helping me digest it. Here is what I’m struggling with -

“I get a par time for evaluating ability against a standard, but don’t like a par for improving ability”.

If we do not use a standard to measure against than WHAT are we using to improve ability?

I think the par time is a great ability improver - it helps w/ the micro adjustments in all of the fundamentals. Here are a few examples - The FAST drill. It has a PAR time..if your not making the time you need to clean up what your messy at, wether it’s your press out, prepping the trigger, etc.. Next example - I want to take Gabe’s class. I’ve read that he gives out pins for hitting under a certain PAR time.

Isn’t the goal to improve ability to hit faster times more accurately? Or to - speed up your rhythm of the fundamentals - and make the necessary hits...while calling your shots and following through?

Good conversation!

Jeremy

I think I understand your question now. Think of two concepts — your current level of ability, and then how to extract the most out of your current level of ability. My thread was not about how to improve your current level of ability, but rather how to extract the best level of performance for whatever level of ability you have today. Using a par time, and descending par time, is one of a number of proven ways to improve your current level of ability, but is, I believe, counterproductive for extracting your best out of what you have this one run, since a par time may be just right, too fast or too slow for you.

So to say it a different way, knock yourself out in practice with all sorts of techniques, including par times, and descending par drills. When you go to lay down the best you have right now, whether in a match, practice, class or for real, shoot at the rhythm that is optimal for your technique and equipment.

[KneeShot]

I think I understand your question now. Think of two concepts — your current level of ability, and then how to extract the most out of your current level of ability. My thread was not about how to improve your current level of ability, but rather how to extract the best level of performance for whatever level of ability you have today. Using a par time, and descending par time, is one of a number of proven ways to improve your current level of ability, but is, I believe, counterproductive for extracting your best out of what you have this one run, since a par time may be just right, too fast or too slow for you.

So to say it a different way, knock yourself out in practice with all sorts of techniques, including par times, and descending par drills. When you go to lay down the best you have right now, whether in a match, practice, class or for real, shoot at the rhythm that is optimal for your technique and equipment.

Crystal clear. Thank you for taking the time to explain it further!