VTOL in 1965, never knew of this before...

[mmc45414]

I searched, but found no current articles, causing me to assume no, but are they approved yet for hauling the POTUS?

I suppose for folks that don't know, there are also these shiny sumbiches:

[TOTS]

The idea of an Osprey Gunship isn't feasible within the context of the MEU, which is the bread and butter of the Corps' reason for existence. There is no room to store an extra Osprey Gunship per deployed ACE.

On top of that, an Osprey Gunship would be a terrible gunship. The entire point of a gunship is a floating battlestation with extended loiter capabilities. An Osprey gunship would be a flying brick and probably no more TOT than a skid, while placing an extreme logistical strain on the MEU.

@TOTS.

Man, solid post, all good info and sums it up nicely.

Couple of points: The IDWS was developed but never really fielded or used outside of MAWTS-1 (think USMC-wide Top Gun school)

The purpose of the MV-22 was to replace the CH-46 as the future Assault Support platform; the whole Air Combat Element of the afore mentioned MEU is built around this role with the AH/UH-1s providing attached/detached escort roles (and, to a lesser extent, ill add the AV-8 harriers and JSFs as well, as detached escorts). Thus, the concept of a V-22 gunship was fundamentally a non-starter for the Marine Corps. Thats more in AFSOC’s wheel house.

The Osprey has some very useful and unique capabilities; however, they come with some limitations that make it hard to operate in a gunship role. They make horrible helicopters, for one. In “helicopter mode” they are much less maneuverable and slower than helicopters. This translates into more exposure to threats in this regime. Not good in a gunfight. Adding armor and heavier weapons/ ammo (i.e., .50 cals) or operating it at higher speeds tends to remove it from the multi-purpose roles that the USMC demands from all platforms (and bleeds into roles played by our fixed-wing squadrons).

Osprey squadrons already have about a dozen item long Mission Essential Task List that their basic, just out of school nugget pilot must maintain proficiency and currency in. Adding a gunship role adds a tremendous amount of requirements in training syllabi, weapons employment, and munitions expertise that is quite frankly, unsupportable. Thus, dedicated shooter squadrons (platforms), the HMLAs.

[TOTS]

And no one’s talking about shooting Hellfire missiles from V-22s? We’re actually doing that already!

[rayrevolver]

And no one’s talking about shooting Hellfire missiles from V-22s? We’re actually doing that already!

Pics or it didn't happen! Haha

[Stephanie B]

I suppose for folks that don't know, there are also these shiny sumbiches:

Didn't the Secret Service look at the V-22 and say "Nope, no way"?

[TC215]

Didn't the Secret Service look at the V-22 and say "Nope, no way"?

Last I read, the presidential helicopter squadron has several, but they just use them to fly presidential support personnel. They’re still not approved to carry the president.

[mmc45414]

Last I read, the presidential helicopter squadron has several, but they just use them to fly presidential support personnel. They’re still not approved to carry the president.

That was my understanding also, but when I tried to research there was a mention of current FLOTUS being transported on one.

Maybe they can use them for Secret Service to get on the ground ahead of Marine One?

[TC215]

That was my understanding also, but when I tried to research there was a mention of current FLOTUS being transported on one.

Maybe they can use them for Secret Service to get on the ground ahead of Marine One?

A couple years ago, when I was still at the local agency here, I was part of the planning of a presidential visit due to being over an element of our SWAT team. Our team worked with the Secret Service CAT guys. They had a contingency plan for everything...But the Osprey’s were never mentioned at all (in hindsight, I wish I would have asked about them). They did bring one of the Marine One helicopters down, though the President flew in on AF1 and never used the helicopter. It was there solely as part of one of the emergency plans/scenarios.

[rayrevolver]

Didn't the Secret Service look at the V-22 and say "Nope, no way"?

This is not directed at you but I'm gonna vent!

Unfortunately, the V-22 program will never shake its early failures. EVERY article, even the most recent, includes words like "troubled" etc when the V-22 is the subject.

It's tiring and still pisses me off. Most folks I know just back from flying them in the real world appreciate the Osprey.

Do a little reading on how many Marines were killed by the Harrier during flight test and then in training. That program doesn't seem to have the same stigma. Maybe because it was before widespread internet access?

I'm off to find my safe space.
SERENITY NOW!!!

[TGS]

As for HMX-1....the majority of aircraft in HMX-1 are not purposed to carry POTUS, including yesteryears' CH-46 and CH-53s in HMX-1 being replaced by the MV-22s. The only aircraft in HMX-1 that carry POTUS are the "white tops", so named for their livery, and consist of the one off custom built Sikorsky VH-92 which just replaced the VH-3 Sea King. There's a precious few VH-60s, but I don't know what they purpose those for as opposed to the VH-92. Maybe smaller LZs? IDK.

The rest of HMX-1 are all green, and carry the detail, strap hangers, and other support personnel.

ETA: The reason for the MV-22 not being produced as a VH-22 probably has more to do with there being no reason to use an Osprey to fly such short distances. You don't need the capabilities the Osprey was designed for when you have a VC-25 warmed up waiting for you. That's just a guess on my part.

Maybe they can use them for Secret Service to get on the ground ahead of Marine One?

Details can basically broken down into three "phases". The advance team, jump team, and plane team.

In other words, the detail is already there well in advance, regardless of MV-22 or not.

Do a little reading on how many Marines were killed by the Harrier during flight test and then in training. That program doesn't seem to have the same stigma. Maybe because it was before widespread internet access?

This is a great point and goes beyond the Harrier.

Both the Huey and Blackhawk killed way more people in development than the Osprey. It just so happened that when the Osprey crashed, they happened to do it while loaded with a squad of marines or a full press avail, so it got big news.

When you look at the data, the Osprey is either one of the safest rotor-winged platforms in service, or one of the dangerous. I think it's portrayed as more dangerous when you look at accident data that collates based off "fatality or $2million in damage". It's an expensive craft, so when it crashes it tends to cost more than more traditional helos.....hence certain safety ratings make it sound more dangerous, when it's actually not.

The CH-46 on the other hand which the MV-22 replaced in their entirety, had a very solid reputation for killing Marines. I don't think anyone was truly sorry to see those go.