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Thread: Suffolk county NY considering banning smoking in private residences

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha Sierra View Post
    Everything everyone does has a negative impact on somebody somewhere. That alone renders your entire argument moot.

    And your last example is even weaker. Loud noises in close quarters impact everyone negatively. Smoking indoors doesn't.
    This is something Iíve wondering to play devils advocate with myself. But I struggled to come up with anything.

    What actions might I be doing on a daily basis in public that are causing negative health impacts to others for my own personal enjoyment? I canít come up with an answer but am open to the possibility they exist.

  2. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Glenn E. Meyer View Post
    Thus in Suffolk county, thousands of folks will be puffing their cancer sticks over their buried and hidden weapons of war and magazines in their basements. Waiting for the boogaloo, they cough away, listening to the waning days of Rush.

    Here's a joke from an old friend, a long time abuser of cigarettes and alcohol from the 70's. His fate wasn't pleasant.

    A man gets on a plane and sits down next to woman passenger. During the flight, he takes out the centerfold from Playboy (told you this was old) and jerks off. As she sits there in horror, he takes out a pack of cigarettes and asks: Mind if I smoke?

    Think about this from a government tyranny, libertarian, does it hurt you, does it offend you? - point of view.
    This is something Iíve wondered for a while but itís kind of a ridiculous argument to most people so I donít bring it up anymore. Why is smoking in public legal, as long as itís more than 10 feet from a entrance, but public masturbation is banned?

    Certainly both smoking and masturbation bring the person doing it enjoyment, and certainly both offend someone else. Yet one is banned and the other is not.

    Some might say but the kids. We canít let them see you jerk off in public. But if they see you smoke and then later decide to try smoking, thatís less detrimental to children.

    If someone was jerking off on a public bench I could look away and it doesnít bother me too much. If someone is smoking I have to cross the street and walk somewhere else since I canít not breathe. It seems that public masturbation is easier to mitigate than smoking since people can look the other way but not not breathe.

    As far as the government / liberty argument in favor of smoking, I agree about liberty. But I do want to point out that cigarette companies in the 20th century marketed to women as a freedom thing. Be a strong free woman. Smoke.

    So for anyone who smokes because they think they have freedom, keep in mind the basis of that is propaganda designed to make money off you.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanch View Post
    What actions might I be doing on a daily basis in public that are causing negative health impacts to others for my own personal enjoyment?
    Why does the qualifier "for my own personal enjoyment" need to be applied? All I see you doing is setting up terms for the debate so you can win.

    What if it was automobile engine exhaust that caused all your respiratory problems? Would you like us to ride horses?

    The problem here is simply YOUR problem and no one else's. The onus to mitigate is on you, and not on anyone else.

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha Sierra View Post
    Why does the qualifier "for my own personal enjoyment" need to be applied? All I see you doing is setting up terms for the debate so you can win.

    What if it was automobile engine exhaust that caused all your respiratory problems? Would you like us to ride horses?

    The problem here is simply YOUR problem and no one else's. The onus to mitigate is on you, and not on anyone else.
    You bring up a fair point about the scale of a problem. Am I the only person who has health problems from second hand cigarette smoke? If I am, and no one else is bothered by it, then I should probably go live in the mountains by myself. However what if 10% of the population is bothered by it, 10% smoke themselves and 80% are indifferent. Then it would be a 50-50 as to who wants to do it and who wants them to not do it. Should that matter?

    What if scientists could prove that 100% of people exposed to second hand smoke are harmed? Would that then shift the onus to get people to not be allowed to smoke anywhere that it might impact someone else, including their own apartment if the air might cross units?

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanch View Post
    You bring up a fair point about the scale of a problem. Am I the only person who has health problems from second hand cigarette smoke? If I am, and no one else is bothered by it, then I should probably go live in the mountains by myself. However what if 10% of the population is bothered by it, 10% smoke themselves and 80% are indifferent. Then it would be a 50-50 as to who wants to do it and who wants them to not do it. Should that matter?

    What if scientists could prove that 100% of people exposed to second hand smoke are harmed? Would that then shift the onus to get people to not be allowed to smoke anywhere that it might impact someone else, including their own apartment if the air might cross units?
    I'm not going to be dragged down into your bullshit theoretical arguments. I'm going to smoke my pipe on my property whenever the fuck I feel like it and I dare anyone to try to stop me.

  6. #36
    And then there are the arguments when there are children involved.....

    --------------------------
    Purposefully and repeatedly exposing children to secondhand smoke ó a known human carcinogen ó is child abuse, according to an opinion piece written by Adam Goldstein, MD, MPH, a professor in the Department of Family Medicine at the University of North Carolina School of Medicine. Drawing from his experience as a family physician caring for families with children who have suffered severe respiratory illness due to secondhand smoke exposure, Dr. Goldstein says it is time for society ó including doctors ó to do much more. Dr. Goldstein argues his point in an essay published in the Point/Counterpoint feature in the March/April 2015 issue of Annals of Family Medicine.
    ďPurposeful and recurrent exposure of children to secondhand smoke by a parent is as abusive as many other commonly accepted physical and emotional traumas of children, like drunk driving or leaving children in a hot car unattended,Ē says Dr. Goldstein, who is director of the UNC School of Medicineís Tobacco Prevention and Evaluation Program (TPEP) and its Tobacco Treatment Program (TTP). ďWe have cared for too many children hospitalized with asthma and pneumonia, caused in large part to their repeated exposure to secondhand smoke.Ē Growing societal sentiment exists that secondhand smoke exposure of children should receive greater attention by providers and policy-makers. Options to intervene include counseling of parents that smoke, legislation, and even court relief at times, according to Dr. Goldstein. Texas, Vermont, Washington, and other states and counties ó as well as other countries ó already prohibit foster parents from smoking around children in cars and homes. ďIf this is true for foster families and smoking, shouldnít it be the case for all parents? Additional legal protection for young children exposed to secondhand smoke makes common sense,Ē says Dr. Goldstein.

    https://www.med.unc.edu/fammed/2015/...dstein-argues/
    ----------------------

    "I have the right to poison my kids if I want to" isn't going to rally a lot of support.

  7. #37
    crossfittingveganfireman? Baldanders's Avatar
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    On a related note, watching Democratic debate live now, and Bloomberg says we can't legalize cannabis 'cause the kids y'know.

    He also sidestepped the question about regulations on sugar with a well-prepared humorous bit.

    Y'know, only a short time ago, while I hate Bloomberg, I thought portraying him as pure evil was a bit much.

    But my views are "evolving."

    What a bastard.
    "...if you donít like revolvers in various shapes and sizes (and, given the thrust of your post, *especially* 5-shot compacts with proven ammo), then you donít like America. Fact." --Sidheshooter

  8. #38
    BIDET MUAD'DIB LittleLebowski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baldanders View Post
    On a related note, watching Democratic debate live now, and Bloomberg says we can't legalize cannabis 'cause the kids y'know.

    He also sidestepped the question about regulations on sugar with a well-prepared humorous bit.

    Y'know, only a short time ago, while I hate Bloomberg, I thought portraying him as pure evil was a bit much.

    But my views are "evolving."

    What a bastard.
    Itís almost like heís drawn to the party that wants to control every aspect of our lives.

  9. #39
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    I did like Bernie's pledge to support small mom and pop marijuana shops with minority ownership as compared to giant corporate marijuana brands. That's a new one. Wonder how that will play out. The things candidates say.

    Why not similar LGS support?

  10. #40
    crossfittingveganfireman? Baldanders's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LittleLebowski View Post
    Itís almost like heís drawn to the party that wants to control every aspect of our lives.
    It's like "1984" was the most influential book on my young brain for a reason!

    Yeah, I know I claimed "Heinlein" very recently, but as much as I love the "Dean of science fiction," his prose never kicked me in the balls like Orwell.

    Imagine a cup of sugary diabetes no larger than 16 oz in your hand....forever.

    Botox Big Gulp blows.
    "...if you donít like revolvers in various shapes and sizes (and, given the thrust of your post, *especially* 5-shot compacts with proven ammo), then you donít like America. Fact." --Sidheshooter

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