9mm 1911 and the 10-8 Extractor Test

[Bill]

For the past few months I've been shooting a Springfield Combat Operator, which is in 9mm. Its my first 9mm 1911. I have moderate experience tuning and running .45 1911's and understand the basics.

The Combat Operators come with a nice bar stock extractor, but the thing had no tension on it from the factory. Gun ran but ejection was erratic, including the odd brass off the forehead. I did my usual light polishing on the front lobe, and retensioned the thing to what I'd call "medium." Gun runs fine (not more brass to face) with a mag in it, but chokes every round without a mag in the gun.

I put a little more tension on it, its now a pretty firm fit; holds the casing flat against the breech face and the slide can be rotated at all angles without it falling out. Gun still runs fine with a mag, and I got 2 out of 10 rounds to eject properly (nice arc to the 3 oclock) without a mag in it, but the other 8 choked, sideways stovepipes.

I'm hesitant to put even more tension on this fucker for fear its gonna start inducing feeding issues. I've never had to tension .45 guns to this point to get them to run properly. Is there something specifically about the geometry in a 9mm gun that needs additional attention? Is the 10-8 extractor test not viable on a 9mm gun for some unknown (to me) reason?

Thanks in advance for any insight.

[Joe in PNG]

On my Colt, I had to stone off a bit of the inside of the extractor, where it met the slide coming out into the chamber- both on the original Colt, and the replacement Wilson.
It helped stop the stovepiping, but I'm still not happy with the extraction.

Will also follow with interest.

[Greg]

Is the tip of the hook making contact with the case?

The only contact should be the tensioning wall and the outer rim of the case.

[NPV]

^Yes to that

Also a 9mm extractor typically is going to feel much tighter going into the tunnel because the diameter of the 9mm case is smaller than the .45 the gun was designed around. So in order to get the proper tension the extractor requires a more extreme bend thus making installation more difficult and giving the perception of over tightened extractor.

I would recommend making life easy and getting a Weigand gauge. If the extraction is confirmed to be tensioned properly you can move onto the next possible issue. The spot the above poster referred to in which they had to remove some material is called the locating pad and may require some filing to add additional tension.

Forgot to add you may want to check if the extractor is clocking in the tunnel before adjusting the tension.

[45dotACP]

The above advice is good advice. You'll have to spend some time with a file to get the gun running the way you want. File down the fitting pad and reduce the claw if you must. Or just file down the fitting pad and have the claw contact the case groove. Either way will work for many thousands of rounds

But remember that the 10-8 extractor test doesn't just test your extractor.

If the ejector is not correct, it won't matter how you got the extractor shaped.

Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk

[ranger]

I have a SA 1911 Range Officer in 9mm. I had some extraction issues so I went to the EGW heavy duty extractor https://www.brownells.com/handgun-pa...prod23561.aspx

That said, I suspect my extraction issues were ammo related but my FTEs did go away.

[p7fl]

Is the 10-8 extractor test not viable on a 9mm gun for some unknown (to me) reason?
Thanks in advance for any insight.

I recently took a 1911/2011 class with Hilton. Part of the class included the extractor test. My 12 year old single stack 9mm STI ran the test without issue. The 9mm STI double stacks and Wilson edc x9 worked as well.

[Bill]

Is the tip of the hook making contact with the case?

The only contact should be the tensioning wall and the outer rim of the case.

Yes, that geometry all appears to be correct: Only the inner wall of the extractor channel contacts the rim of the case. No other contact.

^Yes to that

Also a 9mm extractor typically is going to feel much tighter going into the tunnel because the diameter of the 9mm case is smaller than the .45 the gun was designed around. So in order to get the proper tension the extractor requires a more extreme bend thus making installation more difficult and giving the perception of over tightened extractor.

I would recommend making life easy and getting a Weigand gauge. If the extraction is confirmed to be tensioned properly you can move onto the next possible issue. The spot the above poster referred to in which they had to remove some material is called the locating pad and may require some filing to add additional tension.

Forgot to add you may want to check if the extractor is clocking in the tunnel before adjusting the tension.

Initial inspection showed no significant clocking or forward/aft movement. Gonna check this again

The above advice is good advice. You'll have to spend some time with a file to get the gun running the way you want. File down the fitting pad and reduce the claw if you must. Or just file down the fitting pad and have the claw contact the case groove. Either way will work for many thousands of rounds

But remember that the 10-8 extractor test doesn't just test your extractor.

If the ejector is not correct, it won't matter how you got the extractor shaped.

Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk

I'm afraid addressing the ejector is out of knowledge set. I confirmed its solid in the frame, and isn't being contacted by an over inserted magazine, but beyond that I'm not sure what I'm looking for.


Thanks to all that have commented so far! I think the first thing to do is just add a little more tension and see what happens. Plus I'll check for any slop in the lock up with the fps.

[JHC]

^Yes to that

Also a 9mm extractor typically is going to feel much tighter going into the tunnel because the diameter of the 9mm case is smaller than the .45 the gun was designed around. So in order to get the proper tension the extractor requires a more extreme bend thus making installation more difficult and giving the perception of over tightened extractor.

I would recommend making life easy and getting a Weigand gauge. If the extraction is confirmed to be tensioned properly you can move onto the next possible issue. The spot the above poster referred to in which they had to remove some material is called the locating pad and may require some filing to add additional tension.

Forgot to add you may want to check if the extractor is clocking in the tunnel before adjusting the tension.

This X 100. The Weigand tool is fantastic and a must have for me now. @NPV what does "clocking in the tunnel" mean?

My Lipsey's Combat Operator 9mm extractor created all this frustration for me too at first. Dave Sams who super accurized it, offered me general advice to remove the extractor and clean the channel with each cleaning - offered as generic 1911 advice - regardless of caliber.

Well that's a major PIA prying on the extractor hook to get it out and just as PIA driving the bitch back in. I got to thinking that this in and out kept decreasing my extractor tension so the pistol had a short life span of smooth running ejection.

Now I put a heavy tensioned bend with the marvelous Weigand tool and the pistol runs great with good consistent ejection. It runs and runs as well as my superlative .45s (Sams .45, CQB and SA LB Operator). I have decided to not routinely remove the 9mm's extractor for routine cleaning (approximately 500-800 round intervals) and I'll live with the guilt.

[NPV]

This X 100. The Weigand tool is fantastic and a must have for me now. @NPV what does "clocking in the tunnel" mean?

My Lipsey's Combat Operator 9mm extractor created all this frustration for me too at first. Dave Sams who super accurized it, offered me general advice to remove the extractor and clean the channel with each cleaning - offered as generic 1911 advice - regardless of caliber.

Well that's a major PIA prying on the extractor hook to get it out and just as PIA driving the bitch back in. I got to thinking that this in and out kept decreasing my extractor tension so the pistol had a short life span of smooth running ejection.

Now I put a heavy tensioned bend with the marvelous Weigand tool and the pistol runs great with good consistent ejection. It runs and runs as well as my superlative .45s (Sams .45, CQB and SA LB Operator). I have decided to not routinely remove the 9mm's extractor for routine cleaning (approximately 500-800 round intervals) and I'll live with the guilt.

I think Dawson has a tool that makes removing 9mm extractors a breeze. I honestly only remove mine every 2kish rounds. I’ve checked after 500 and there simply isn’t enough buildup to justify cleaning the tunnel that often IMO.

As for the clocking, that just means the extractor is rotating in the tunnel. So when the handgun is fired and goes through it’s extraction/ejection cycle the extractor claw can rotate into a position that is less than optimal causing extraction or ejection issues. Usually a loose fitting FPS is the culprit and it can be rectified by fitting a new EGW or similar FPS. But I’ve seen extractors with the FPS slot (not sure if that the correct terminology) filed out way too much causing the same issue.

When in doubt I just refit both, they’re cheap enough and I prefer fitting them to each other at the same time.