Active Army to FBI

[JDD]

I graduated a federal agency academy at 39. Don’t rush into it. As suggested earlier, really do your homework on all of the agencies and what they have to offer.

I can't emphasize this enough.

Don't apply to an agency that you can't see yourself enjoying the work with. Not all 1811 type positions are the same, and if you are going to be constantly disgruntled that you are doing X when you really want to be doing Y, your peers will figure it out pretty quick. Not to mention, work life balance for the most recognizable three letter agencies frequently sucks, so you wont necessarily be able to balance it out by enjoying the home life.

My agency is relatively unique in its mission set, and I have more than a few peers who are really pissed that they are not XY or Z other organization.

[vcdgrips]

"On a side note, there are many OIG jobs listed but most of those are filled by 1811s from busier agencies like USSS, HSI etc looking for a slower pace or more stability at home. There is literally a former USSS mafia within the OIGs and your odds of getting one of those jobs off the street is low if they can hire someone who is already FLETC CITP certified."


From the very close outside looking in, I would concur that their is a USSS " mafia" in many OIGs for the reasons stated. Having said that, I think the highlighted statement is a bit off the mark, both generally and specifically to the OP. I have seen more than a few OIG agents being hired with NO prior LEO at all. Indeed, many OIGs have long standing Intern and Co-Op programs such that they hire a fair number of 1811 SAs with no real job experience at all right out of college.

The OP is an academy grad, combat veteran etc. I would be extremely surprised if he did not catch on as an 1811 if that what he wants to do. I would venture to say that the most likely scenario is a job offer with one agency, only to have another pop their offer at a later date. I know of more than one DEA/FBI agent who was in one academy at Quantico only to ultimately go over the other side so to speak. The same has happened at FLETC as well between other agencies.

The real question is compatibility with the wife's medical career.

Most agencies are not making people move from their first office assignment so long as the agency's needs are met and the agent understands that not moving is likely to consign them to being line agents for their career. That has certainly been the case for dozens of FBI, DEA, ATF, HSI and OIG agents I have worked with. Indeed, almost to an agent, they moved only when they wanted to because they wanted to become a supervisor or they stubbed their toe and got "voluntold." This has been particularly true since the downturn of 2008-2009 when real estate was wonky and good people found themselves upside down in their houses.

That is not to say that agents do not have to go places on TDY or sometime get volunteered to go somewhere for a period of time i.e. acting as a adjunct instructor for an academy class for 12-16 weeks etc.

But, from the outside looking in, the days of the FBI model where you made three moves before your office of preference in the twilight of your career are over. It was simply costing too much money and too many good agents to make people move for the sake of making people move.

From my POV, the wife will ultimately have more flexibility in placement the the OP. Her residency placement is likely to resolve well before the OP is hired, graduated and posted from a federal LEO. academy. I suspect that she can get a job as a Dr. after her residency where the OP is going to be a 1st office agent far easier than he can control his first office placement. In the interim, there may be some time spent apart. Thankfully, there are not kids in the picture nor planned for which would make such temporary separation that much more difficult.

As others have stated, please feel free to PM as needed. Be safe and well.

[TheRoland]

I'm sure this is not what was asked, but I'm friends with several couples where one of them is/was doing Residency match. Every couple where the non-medical person didn't simply go wherever the matching person needed are no longer couples.

I'd probably recommend dealing with the match first if at all possible.

[HCM]

"On a side note, there are many OIG jobs listed but most of those are filled by 1811s from busier agencies like USSS, HSI etc looking for a slower pace or more stability at home. There is literally a former USSS mafia within the OIGs and your odds of getting one of those jobs off the street is low if they can hire someone who is already FLETC CITP certified."


From the very close outside looking in, I would concur that their is a USSS " mafia" in many OIGs for the reasons stated. Having said that, I think the highlighted statement is a bit off the mark, both generally and specifically to the OP. I have seen more than a few OIG agents being hired with NO prior LEO at all. Indeed, many OIGs have long standing Intern and Co-Op programs such that they hire a fair number of 1811 SAs with no real job experience at all right out of college.

The OP is an academy grad, combat veteran etc. I would be extremely surprised if he did not catch on as an 1811 if that what he wants to do. I would venture to say that the most likely scenario is a job offer with one agency, only to have another pop their offer at a later date. I know of more than one DEA/FBI agent who was in one academy at Quantico only to ultimately go over the other side so to speak. The same has happened at FLETC as well between other agencies.

The real question is compatibility with the wife's medical career.

Most agencies are not making people move from their first office assignment so long as the agency's needs are met and the agent understands that not moving is likely to consign them to being line agents for their career. That has certainly been the case for dozens of FBI, DEA, ATF, HSI and OIG agents I have worked with. Indeed, almost to an agent, they moved only when they wanted to because they wanted to become a supervisor or they stubbed their toe and got "voluntold." This has been particularly true since the downturn of 2008-2009 when real estate was wonky and good people found themselves upside down in their houses.

That is not to say that agents do not have to go places on TDY or sometime get volunteered to go somewhere for a period of time i.e. acting as a adjunct instructor for an academy class for 12-16 weeks etc.

But, from the outside looking in, the days of the FBI model where you made three moves before your office of preference in the twilight of your career are over. It was simply costing too much money and too many good agents to make people move for the sake of making people move.

From my POV, the wife will ultimately have more flexibility in placement the the OP. Her residency placement is likely to resolve well before the OP is hired, graduated and posted from a federal LEO. academy. I suspect that she can get a job as a Dr. after her residency where the OP is going to be a 1st office agent far easier than he can control his first office placement. In the interim, there may be some time spent apart. Thankfully, there are not kids in the picture nor planned for which would make such temporary separation that much more difficult.

As others have stated, please feel free to PM as needed. Be safe and well.

The LE job market was much more competitive 10-20 years ago than it is now so hiring may have loosened up in the OIG agencies but the USSS, and to a lesser extent HSI Mafia is still a real thing. On the USSS side Being on the road 200+ days a year during election years can be very difficult for families. On the HSI side it is often someone taking an OIG job to get out of a location they feel stuck in.

While agencies are less likely to make people move, there are still cultural requirements that one do headquarters time in DC if you want to advance above a certain level, work overseas, etc.. In my area rookie DEA and FBI agents are normally assigned to the border offices. One of their local offices just got the first batch of rookie agents to avoid border duty in five or six years. All of four are prior state and local LE and two were previously employed by the bureau in other capacities. None of them picked our city as their first choice.

The OP might get a hardship exception to be posted in or near his wife’s residency location but that would be easier done if that location is known when he comes on board.

On another note, a few agencies have consistent hiring. Hiring new agents seems to run hot and cold in most agencies. They will hire for a couple years then barely hire anyone for a couple years. If the OP is interested in the FBI now would be a good time as they are in the middle of a hiring surge.

[TheNewbie]

The offices I would want are the ones no one else would want. That is certainly in my favor. The Feds not wanting me however is not.


@HCM has more up to date and better info on DPS than I do. Still, I think it's something you should consider.


Is ICE currently hiring?

[HCM]

Is ICE currently hiring?

Yes

[Nephrology]

From my POV, the wife will ultimately have more flexibility in placement the the OP. Her residency placement is likely to resolve well before the OP is hired, graduated and posted from a federal LEO. academy. I suspect that she can get a job as a Dr. after her residency where the OP is going to be a 1st office agent far easier than he can control his first office placement.

This very much depends on what his wife wants to do in her career. If she has fairly uncompetitive aspirations for her medical career - for example, family medicine residency (3 years, many locations) and a private practice outpatient office job after - she may have more flexibility, yes.

However, on the "rock star" end of the spectrum - for example, neurosurgical residency (8 years....) followed by practice at an academic medical center - your options are much more limited. For a competitive specialty like neurosurgery, it is much harder to be picky about residency location as there are fewer programs and many applicants. Afterwards, if she wants a career at a university hospital, where she can work with "the best of the best" (or at least the most prestigious) colleagues, etc, she will be similarly at the mercy of a fairly tight job market.

There is a lot of middle ground between the two ends of the spectrum, but that's why it's important to have this conversation now. If his wife is a hard charger with competitive career aspirations, it will be much harder to compromise on location. Med students are hard workers and many are intrinsically driven to seek challenge; for competitive people like this, compromising on dream job/residency can be a big disappointment.

That's why I think it is really important to figure this out now, so that there is lots of time to work an acceptable compromise in advance. I can imagine how hard it would be to interview at a bunch of places you have set your sights on, only to bury them on your rank list to accommodate geographic limitations. Better to figure this out now so her applications are focused and her expectations set well in advance.

I'm sure this is not what was asked, but I'm friends with several couples where one of them is/was doing Residency match. Every couple where the non-medical person didn't simply go wherever the matching person needed are no longer couples.

I'd probably recommend dealing with the match first if at all possible.

Residency is brutal and extremely challenging on long distance couples. That is an outcome you want to avoid if at all possible.

[jnc36rcpd]

From an outside LEO point of view, I suspect OIG's, like all agencies vary across the spectrun. Some years ago, I recall a special agent for the Veterans OIG in New York City waging a drug war against dealing in a VA hospital. This resulted in an award from a peer assicuation (FLEOA?) and probably some great stories.

I'll also remark that the Food and Drug Administration Office of Criminal Investigations seemed to have remarkably happy special agents who seemed to largely have migrated from other agencies. Their headquarters was in my jurisdiction and there was a phone line problem that resulted in multiple 911 hangups from their facility. I also stopped a deputy director who blew through my radar one day who regaled me with tales of their mission. In retrospect, I should have asked about an age waiver before handing him his license back. For those who take offense, his speed was not so fast that a butcher, baker, or candlestick maker could not have driven away with a warning.

[psalms144.1]

From an outside LEO point of view, I suspect OIG's, like all agencies vary across the spectrun.

Likewise, HUD OIG agents can have some of the toughest "hands on" experience you're likely to find in federal LE. I've worked several cases with USPS OIG, and while there are LOTS of "employee" cases they deal with, they do a bunch of other pretty cool stuff as well, and don't seem to have a big mobility policy.

I'll just take a second to interject one more thought:

Your wife is going to devote an ENORMOUS amount of her time, talent and energy to chase her dreams. As others have stated, what she wants to do as a doctor is going to be the driving force in her life, and I seriously doubt she's going to want to follow your career around the country/world. She will also make, in a slow year, more than you're likely to make in a decade as a Federal Agent, or a career as a local LEO, so her career aspirations might have more "weight" than yours. My brother is a surgeon (pediatrics), and owns one of the largest and most successful practices in the SW (he has 16 or 18 other surgeons working for him). He still pulls 70+ hour weeks at 57 years old and almost 30 years in the business, and his life still revolves around his call schedule. His wife is a dual-rated CV and trauma surgeon, who is now working part time (one week of call per month) on staff at a local hospital just to keep her hand in, and be free to deal with the family issues that real life entails. Of course, she gets paid more than I do (33 years of federal service, and capped out as a GS-13 step 10 with LEAP)...

[Le Français]

She will also make, in a slow year, more than you're likely to make in a decade as a Federal Agent, or a career as a local LEO, so her career aspirations might have more "weight" than yours.

What percentage of doctors make over, say, $1,500,000 in a slow year?