I am the owner of Agile/Training and Consulting
www.agiletactical.com
I am the owner of Agile/Training and Consulting
www.agiletactical.com
FIFY.
At $1.15 per round according to the manufacturer's website, anyone is simply better off buying HSTs which can be found for 9mm for about 70% of the cost here: https://www.targetsportsusa.com/9mm-...ammo-c-51.aspx
Last edited by the Schwartz; 03-24-2020 at 10:52 PM.
''Politics is for the present, but an equation is for eternity.'' ―Albert Einstein
Full disclosure per the Pistol-Forum CoC: I am the author of Quantitative Ammunition Selection.
Stick with something proven and read Doc’s stickies, especially the mindset pieces. Get the cheapest ammo you can find in the largest quantity that meets your needs. At the risk of piling on, a majority of both LGS employees and servicemembers don’t have the resume to talk about ballistics.“Teaching people a large number of sword techniques is turning the way into a business of selling goods, making beginners believe that there is something profound in their training by impressing them with a variety of techniques. This attitude toward strategy must be avoided, because thinking that there is a variety of ways of cutting a man down is evidence of a disturbed mind. In the world, different ways of cutting a man down do not exist.” - Musashi
The first indication a bad guy should have that I'm dangerous is when his
disembodied soul is looking down at his own corpse wondering what happened.
Those are mighty big ''if''s.
While encountering an armored threat is certainly not impossible for non-LE carriers, it is a relatively improbable event—so I question the value of this particular product. Perhaps if one finds themselves in some third-world hell hole over-run with armored death-squads it might be of value.
In the more probable scenarios facing carriers here in the US, it is still just really expensive FMJ and due to its very streamlined, almost conical nose profile, permanent tissue damage produced by the TUI is likely to be slightly less than that seen with the underwhelming FMJRN in any caliber. Not much of ''selling point'' in my opinion....
As for Harrell's videos, I have absolutely no confidence in their validity. They fail when considered against even the slightest scientific rigor and, at their best, are merely entertaining.
While the Fort Scott 9mm TUI rounds did penetrate the soft armor he used, the test media Mr. Harrell uses is, well, valueless.
1.) While the ribs in the plastic packages was at some point living tissue, it does not correctly model living tissue. During its processing, it has been 1.) drained of blood, 2.) aged over a certain time period to allow certain enzymatic and bacterial processes to partially degrade the strength of the muscle fibers making it more tender (which means that its elastic strength has been diminished by some unknown quantity), and, 3.) may have been frozen—Heaven knows how many times—which also further degrades the strength of the muscle fibers making it up. As a result, because of these unknown factors as well as the degradation of the tissue itself, it is neither a valid nor reliable predictor of terminal ballistic performance.
2.) Harrell's use of citrus fruits as a surrogate for pulmonary tissues is ridiculous. Sometimes he uses oranges, other times he uses grapefruit. I am aware of no research that supports the use of various citrus fruits as surrogates for human soft tissues (of any type) and I'll bet that neither does Mr. Harrell.
3.) Finally, Mr. Harrell provides no documentation as to the condition of the soft body armor he is using in his test. For all we know, it could be brand new or it could be an older, highly-stressed, out-of-date product that he scrounged just for his video. Given the low-dollar production value typical of Mr. Harrell's videos, I am inclined to suspect that it is more likely the latter than the former. Either way, we have no idea what he used, its condition or its test-worthiness. I noticed that both of the test samples looked pretty 'worn'.
Copy that.
''Politics is for the present, but an equation is for eternity.'' ―Albert Einstein
Full disclosure per the Pistol-Forum CoC: I am the author of Quantitative Ammunition Selection.
In many of Harrell's videos, you can see the label of the armor facing the camera, the one that says "This side towards body." Armor is constructed to function in a directional manner, with a strike face and back face. Shooting a piece of armor backwards from the way it is intended will lead to poor results.
Unless one is doing it for pure kewl factor, shooting fruit & veggies for serious ballistic purposes is just derp.
"You win 100% of the fights you avoid. If you're not there when it happens, you don't lose." - William Aprill
"I've owned a guitar for 31 years and that sure hasn't made me a musician, let alone an expert. It's made me a guy who owns a guitar."- BBI
Great eyes! You win the Highest Attention to Detail Award™! I've never bothered examining Harrell's videos to the same degree as you simply because I find his work to be.....well....inane and extremely tedious. Your point is very well-taken. I'd have missed his failure to correctly orient the soft armor test panels if you hadn't mentioned that. That's another point that discredits the validity of these videos. Thanks.
''Politics is for the present, but an equation is for eternity.'' ―Albert Einstein
Full disclosure per the Pistol-Forum CoC: I am the author of Quantitative Ammunition Selection.